[EscoLehGo]

I was talking to this lady friend of mine the other day who I'm currently in the trial stages of a potential relationship with and she expressed to me that she one day hopes to have a big wedding ceremony with a huge fancy ring and all the bells and whistles. I asked her why she deemed all that to be necessary for a man to express her love to her and she failed to answer in a way that didn't sound shallow or materialistic. It was basically like "if a man really loves me, he or his family will shell out thousands of dollars so he can show off how much I matter to him to all my friends and family". I asked her how she would feel if she was in a relationship with a man she really loved but they never married and she told me she'd eventually leave the man if he refused to pop the question.

What is this f*ckery? Do weddings, marriage and elaborate ceremonies seem a bit dated and archaic to anyone else? Especially considering that so many of them end in violent and messy failure these days. Do any of you aspire to get married one day and why? What's so important about completing an ancient ritual, that gives clear bias to females in the court system by the way, to show that your monogamous relationship is serious?

[goin-god]

I wont get married, mainly because it's a religious ceremony. And because of the legal part.
Basicly, if you love someone you don't need to get married to show your love. If the other person disagrees, said person dosn't love you enough.

[EscoLehGo]

QUOTE (goin-god @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 16:04)

I wont get married, mainly because it's a religious ceremony. And because of the legal part. Basicly, if you love someone you don't need to get married to show your love. If the other person disagrees, said person dosn't love you enough.

I agree, the legal part is a total biased mess as well, especially if the husband is the earner. I don't understand why it's still such a big deal in the 21st century, seems like a big sad trap to me.

[Xcommunicated]

Rollins and Black Flag summed it up pretty well for me:




Seriously though, I have no intention of ever walking down the isle of pseudo-royal faggotry in an overpriced tux just to prove a point.

[Jesus'En'Hitler420]

Because they have been conditioned since little girls that that is the way a relationship runs the course. We all know it's bullsh*t, even them, but that day with the bell and whistles is meant to be for them. It's the same reason we remember anniversaries: for them. It's the same reason we celebrate Valentine's Day: for them.

[Outcast]

I think marriage gives a sense of stability in life which, I'm sure, many of us will need in our later years.

[EscoLehGo]

QUOTE (Outcast @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 16:59)

I think marriage gives a sense of stability in life which, I'm sure, many of us will need in our later years.

Really? How does it give a sense of stability exactly? Legally tethering yourself to another human being seems like a bad idea to me especially since if doesn't work out they can take half your sh*t away regardless if they worked for it or not.

@Xcommunicated that reminded me of some sort of really dark Tim and Eric sketch, Fam-lee MAAAN, I understand the angst though. I don't want to become one of those f*ckers driving a mini van and dying on the inside as my soul slowly erodes under the weight of my unsatisfying suburban existence.

@JH420 that's the thing though, I don't think they think it's bullsh*t, I think they really view it as a magical union between to human beings that some how transcends a normal humdrum relationship into some kind of Disney fantasy. Like putting that ring on their finger will create a new bond between the two of you and a deeper level of understanding will be achieved after the ceremony is complete.

[Outcast]

QUOTE (EscoLehGo @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 17:06)

QUOTE (Outcast @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 16:59) I think marriage gives a sense of stability in life which, I'm sure, many of us will need in our later years. Really? How does it give a sense of stability exactly? Legally tethering yourself to another human being seems like a bad idea to me especially since if doesn't work out they can take half your sh*t away regardless if they worked for it or not.

I'm sure many of us would choose to have someone to grow old with than die alone. I'm not saying that's how all marriages end up, but the idea of marriage itself would be that. I'm not supporting marriage, I just think if it really was as pointless as you make it out to be, the tradition would've died out long ago.

[EscoLehGo]

QUOTE (Outcast @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 17:11)

I'm sure many of us would choose to have someone to grow old with than die alone. I'm not saying that's how all marriages end up, but the idea of marriage itself would be that. I'm not supporting marriage, I just think if it really was as pointless as you make it out to be, the tradition would've died out long ago.

So you'll die alone if you don't get married (ignoring the fact that we all essentially will die alone)? What keeps you from being monogamous with someone you love and connect with without engaging in marriage? Is that always the final step to a successful relationship? There are plenty of things that are pointless that people still do out of tradition, like saying "bless you!" after someone sneezes. Just because something has been around for years and years doesn't give it prestige or validation, it just means it's been accepted a social or cultural norm for whatever reason.

[goin-god]

QUOTE (Outcast @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 14:11)

QUOTE (EscoLehGo @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 17:06) QUOTE (Outcast @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 16:59) I think marriage gives a sense of stability in life which, I'm sure, many of us will need in our later years. Really? How does it give a sense of stability exactly? Legally tethering yourself to another human being seems like a bad idea to me especially since if doesn't work out they can take half your sh*t away regardless if they worked for it or not. I'm sure many of us would choose to have someone to grow old with than die alone. I'm not saying that's how all marriages end up, but the idea of marriage itself would be that. I'm not supporting marriage, I just think if it really was as pointless as you make it out to be, the tradition would've died out long ago.

You don't need to get married to be with someone for life.

[Chunkyman]

I'm a bit old-fashion, I think marriage can potentially be a healthy step to take in a relationship (although the government should have no involvement in it like it currently does).

If I were the type to have relationships, eventually getting married would be likely.

[Rebel]

How about you guys stop bitching about marriage and just get a f*cking prenuptial agreement? Don't buy into all the fancy expensive weddings and just go down to the local registry office. Still married in 30 years? Go for a big celebration. I don't understand why its a huge deal, just don't go into it without backing your sh*t up.

[EscoLehGo]

QUOTE (Rebel @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 18:21)

How about you guys stop bitching about marriage and just get a f*cking prenuptial agreement? Don't buy into all the fancy expensive weddings and just go down to the local registry office. Still married in 30 years? Go for a big celebration. I don't understand why its a huge deal, just don't go into it without backing your sh*t up.

Why even do that though? What does a piece of paper issued at the courthouse do to make you feel better about your monogamous relationship? Does it make it more "official" for you and to whom does it make more official? To yourself or society? This is what I fundamentally don't get about marriage in any capacity, it seems like such a superficial thing with tons of potentially life wrecking legal consequences if things go to sh*t. Also, prenups don't mean sh*t if you have a capable lawyer at your side.

[Rebel]

QUOTE (EscoLehGo @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 18:46)

QUOTE (Rebel @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 18:21) How about you guys stop bitching about marriage and just get a f*cking prenuptial agreement? Don't buy into all the fancy expensive weddings and just go down to the local registry office. Still married in 30 years? Go for a big celebration. I don't understand why its a huge deal, just don't go into it without backing your sh*t up. Why even do that though? What does a piece of paper issued at the courthouse do to make you feel better about your monogamous relationship? Does it make it more "official" for you and to whom does it make more official? To yourself or society? This is what I fundamentally don't get about marriage in any capacity, it seems like such a superficial thing with tons of potentially life wrecking legal consequences if things go to sh*t. Also, prenups don't mean sh*t if you have a capable lawyer at your side.

Because some people believe that its the next stage in relationships or the fact that it shows that they are ready for a ''full on'' commitment? Who knows, ask someone who cares so much about weddings? My point was that if one half of the couple wants to get married, and the other person isn't that bothered either way you'd think they'd would maybe agree to doing it the cheap way.

And as for the legal stuff, I'm pretty sure that 90% of the normal population that get married cannot afford a lawyer that will swing around a prenup. Nor do I think that it would be within the best interest of either party to roll over such an agreement considering the prenup they laid out to begin with would be both in their interests. Not to mention what bullsh*t hassle it would be to get around a legal document if they just want a divorce over.

There's no need to get your pants in a damn twist just because people feel like its right to get married or not, but at the end of the day it can cause huge upsets if one of either party does not want to get married and the other person does.

Everyone feels different about marriage. Some think its bullsh*t hassle, while others don't. Hell most people probably have no strong feelings either way about it.

[EscoLehGo]

QUOTE (Rebel @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 18:55)

There's no need to get your pants in a damn twist just because people feel like its right to get married or not, but at the end of the day it can cause huge upsets if one of either party does not want to get married and the other person does.

Who has their pants in a "twist" and how does that happens anyways? Do you mean panties? I don't wear those. I'm just asking what's so important about marriage and it still is a really big deal to the majority of American society since you have an entire segment of the population fighting for their federal right to participate in it. I just think it's ancient and played out, it means nothing in the long run, the only sentimental value it holds is largely temporary and superficial. Someone just wants to wear a ring and let people know they're married and they have fulfilled their life's purpose, they also want to know that if they get broken up with this time that they can potentially now leave with half their sh*t instead of just getting kicked out. Divorces can get nasty, people will dish out the cash to cause pain to their former "hubby" or "wifey" and divorce proceedings often much more drawn out and vicious than they are quick and decisive.

[Chunkyman]

...go together like a horse and carriage. This I tell you broooother, you can't have one without the other.

Can't believe I didn't notice that sooner.

[Rebel]

QUOTE (EscoLehGo @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 19:12)

QUOTE (Rebel @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 18:55) There's no need to get your pants in a damn twist just because people feel like its right to get married or not, but at the end of the day it can cause huge upsets if one of either party does not want to get married and the other person does. Who has their pants in a "twist" and how does that happens anyways? Do you mean panties? I don't wear those. I'm just asking what's so important about marriage and it still is a really big deal to the majority of American society since you have an entire segment of the population fighting for their federal right to participate in it. I just think it's ancient and played out, it means nothing in the long run, the only sentimental value it holds is largely temporary and superficial. Someone just wants to wear a ring and let people know they're married and they have fulfilled their life's purpose, they also want to know that if they get broken up with this time that they can potentially now leave with half their sh*t instead of just getting kicked out. Divorces can get nasty, people will dish out the cash to cause pain to their former "hubby" or "wifey" and divorce proceedings often much more drawn out and vicious than they are quick and decisive.

I'm going to ignore everything you've said apart from the pants issue..

I'm from England, we do not use the word panties. So I mean pants.

Also, for the record I can't take your outlook seriously when you deem marriage to be ''materialistic'' I'm open to either sides, the only ''materialistic'' thing is the wedding - and if you have the money do it go for it. If not, then don't get yourself into financial difficulties.

[Typhus]

QUOTE (Jesus'En'Hitler420 @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 16:42)

Because they have been conditioned since little girls that that is the way a relationship runs the course. We all know it's bullsh*t, even them, but that day with the bell and whistles is meant to be for them. It's the same reason we remember anniversaries: for them. It's the same reason we celebrate Valentine's Day: for them.

And it never occurs to a man to tell his partner just how egocentric they're being?
Because from where I'm standing it seems like emotions overruling common sense, prudence and frugality.

[trip]

QUOTE (goin-god @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 12:04)

I wont get married, mainly because it's a religious ceremony. And because of the legal part. Basicly, if you love someone you don't need to get married to show your love. If the other person disagrees, said person dosn't love you enough.

It does not have to be a religious ceremony. I'm an atheist and I am married to an atheist. We were married by a judge and didn't even exchange rings or anything. We still have different last names and all that.

The legal part can be an advantage in some cases. Actually, the legal reasons are why I am married today. We never planed on getting married and we were a happy couple for a good 13 years before we were married. I ended up getting a job with good healthcare and other nice benefits. Even though where I live 'domestic partnership' is honored - the catch is you have to be of the same sex to claim domestic partnership - so we decided to just get married.

Here is a small example of one of the benefits: If I die, my wife receives my paycheck for the rest of her life.

[goin-god]

QUOTE (trip @ Wednesday, Jun 27 2012, 18:45)

Here is a small example of one of the benefits: If I die, my wife receives my paycheck for the rest of her life.

And if I want divorce I have to give her 50% of "our" property.