[MiamiVice1984]

QUOTE (PSRepublika @ Monday, May 14 2012, 22:58)

QUOTE (MiamiVice1984 @ Monday, May 14 2012, 22:12) QUOTE (PSRepublika @ Friday, May 11 2012, 07:37) Not much. 7 years old consoles, and 8GB DVDs. Are you crazy? or are you just a PC fanboy? Have you played Uncharted 3? or God Of War 3? Probably not. I said DVDs, not blu-rays... Yes, I played all 3 uncharteds, gow3, MGS4, etc. All of them are 30-50GB games, but they are on blu-ray, so I don't see your point... P.S. I'm actually a console fanboy.

Oh well... What i was trying to say was that Console graphics is still good. Its far from outdated.

[Death2Drugs]

QUOTE (MiamiVice1984 @ Monday, May 14 2012, 23:27)

QUOTE (PSRepublika @ Monday, May 14 2012, 22:58) QUOTE (MiamiVice1984 @ Monday, May 14 2012, 22:12) QUOTE (PSRepublika @ Friday, May 11 2012, 07:37) Not much. 7 years old consoles, and 8GB DVDs. Are you crazy? or are you just a PC fanboy? Have you played Uncharted 3? or God Of War 3? Probably not. I said DVDs, not blu-rays... Yes, I played all 3 uncharteds, gow3, MGS4, etc. All of them are 30-50GB games, but they are on blu-ray, so I don't see your point... P.S. I'm actually a console fanboy. Oh well... What i was trying to say was that Console graphics is still good. Its far from outdated.

The XBOX 360 has since expanded it's disc and has improved its design. It can definitely handle V.

[mkey82]

^^^ improved design? Are you being quite serious?

[SL1DE]

QUOTE (Death2Drugs @ Tuesday, May 15 2012, 01:39)

QUOTE (MiamiVice1984 @ Monday, May 14 2012, 23:27) QUOTE (PSRepublika @ Monday, May 14 2012, 22:58) QUOTE (MiamiVice1984 @ Monday, May 14 2012, 22:12) QUOTE (PSRepublika @ Friday, May 11 2012, 07:37) Not much. 7 years old consoles, and 8GB DVDs. Are you crazy? or are you just a PC fanboy? Have you played Uncharted 3? or God Of War 3? Probably not. I said DVDs, not blu-rays... Yes, I played all 3 uncharteds, gow3, MGS4, etc. All of them are 30-50GB games, but they are on blu-ray, so I don't see your point... P.S. I'm actually a console fanboy. Oh well... What i was trying to say was that Console graphics is still good. Its far from outdated. The XBOX 360 has since expanded it's disc and has improved its design. It can definitely handle V.

Xbox has expanded their disc, but it's still no where near PS3's 30-50GB's, so they're still holding games back like "oh geez, we have to make it fit on an Xbox disc, /delete half the game.

[crackhead91090]

QUOTE (Karly @ Thursday, May 10 2012, 23:31)

In terms of the visuals, sounds and gameplay. How much better can GTA V be over GTA IV, LA Noire and RDR? Is the current gen capable of delivering a game of much better quality?

Judging by the trailer, it still has alot of room to stretch, I hope the next gen console comes out soon, so we can at least get one more GTA before the end of this century

[urbanfire]

Well, upon closer inspection of the trailer, it seems to me that GTA V has worse anti-aliasing than RDR.

Graphics have been tweaked since GTA IV, but I doubt they'd be much better than RDR's (which was quite good IMO). Remember RDR is console exclusive (no PC), so it's graphics would be the baseline for GTA V.

I just hope that trailer was a pre-alpha build and that the aliasing will improve in the final game.

[CaptRobau]

Just some technical info,so that we know what we're talking about exactly:

Xbox 360 uses dual-layer DVDs which currently have the capacity of 7.8 GB

PS3 uses Blu-ray Discs which carries around 50 GB of data but multiple layers can be added to increase it to 200 GB. The latter is probably not even likely as I've never seen a game install more than 25 GB on my PC, so I doubt the PS3 would need more than 50.

The consoles' other hardware specs are less important because they're much closer together and the disparity can always be equalized by lowering a certain graphics setting on the 360. The limited storage capacity is the main problem and there are ways around it. What is most likely is to have multiple discs for the 360 version (2-3 discs). Each DVD would have the entire game world on it (textures, models, etc.) but only part of the missions (mission files, sounds, animations, etc.). It's what they did with L.A. Noire and by all accounts it worked fine. One DVD could also contain the multiplayer

Still, if that's not enough to even it out, than you can also use Battlefield 3's solution. That game had low-res graphics when you played the game from the disc but if you had a 360 model with a HDD you were given the option of installing a high-res texture pack (PS3 often installs its games too, to improve speed). That would be ideal as it would allow good graphics and room on the disc to have a big, detailed world.


Example of BF3's high-res texture pack

In the end, there's enough that can be done with 360's limited capacity. It might not make it the ultimate platform to play the game on, but I don't think many people will be turned off completely because they have to change a disc once when playing the singleplayer campaign or having blurrier graphics because they're refusing to shell out for a HDD version (are there still many people with the Core/Arcade version?). So the 360 doesn't need to hold it back too much.

[mkey82]

QUOTE (CaptRobau @ Tuesday, May 15 2012, 10:28)

Each DVD would have the entire game world on it (textures, models, etc.) but only part of the missions (mission files, sounds, animations, etc.). It's what they did with L.A. Noire and by all accounts it worked fine. One DVD could also contain the multiplayer

For a person who supposedly knows exactly what they're talking about, you sure spout a lot of bullcrap.

"missions files" - what would these be in a typical GTA game?
"sounds" - past some low bitrate speech, how much sound data can a typical GTA campaign contain?
"animations" - have you played any GTAs to date? GTA cut-scenes are done in-game so that every cut-scense consists of a compiled script sized at about a few kB worth of data

In other words - you can not split a typical GTA game on a few disks without effectively breaking up the map.

I have already tried to explain this issue here http://www.gtaforums.com/index.php?showtop...entry1061258452 I find that breakdown to be very simplistic and even if not accurate it should provide for a good/decent grasp of data size relations.

This post has been edited by mkey82 on Tuesday, May 15 2012, 09:58

[CaptRobau]

Bullcr*p might be a bit much. I went from the fact that L.A. Noire was able to be released on 3 DVDs, but then again it's animations might be much, much bigger and its world is more static requiring each DVD to contain less general stuff. To answer your question about what I meant with each:
-Missions files, would be mission specific data such as props, etc.
-Sounds, most of this would be the voices in cutscenes and the general chatter of NPCs that only appear in one part of the game (in GTA IV that might've been someone like Phil Bell who was only introduced in the second half of the game)
-Animations would be the cutscene specific animations and the general animations of NPCs that only appear in one part of the game

If I look at GTA IV's files, I do see stuff that you can split (maybe I'm wrong about some of what some of the things contain, just let me know):

anim/cuts.img - Cutscene stuff, if cut in half gives 250 Mb
anim/cutsprops.img - Cutscene specific cutscene props, if cut in half gives roughly 50 Mb
audio/sfx/cutscenes.rpf - Cutscene specific audio, if cut in half gives roughly 400 Mb
audio/sfx/radio_news.rpf - Played only after certain missions so it can be divided as well, if cut in half gives roughly 90 Mb
audio/sfx/scripted_speech.rpf - Mission specific audio (as in stuff that is said in a mission but outside of a cutscene), if cut in half gives roughly 350 Mb
audio/sfx/speech.rpf - General NPC chatter, since it includes peds let's say splitting it up (to account for characters that only appear in the second half) makes the whole file 10% smaller, that's 150 Mb
Couldn't find the specific files related to multiplayer (which you could also put on only one of the DVDs) but you let's say it's at least 50 Mb of stuff

In total you can cut roughly 1300 Mb on each DVD by splitting the game over 2 DVDs. That's 2.6 Gb of data to play around with. Anyway, Rockstar did do something to make work on Xbox 360 (a guaranteed platform as it's almost half their audience, 9 million sales for GTA IV alone). We've all seen the trailer and what we've seen points to a larger, more detailed world. The 360 will somehow run it. My suggestion might be the way they do it, it might not, who knows. Will see in about a year or so (hopefully).

[theworldfamous]

Wow.. lots of nonsense and wishful thinking in this topic. When it comes down to it.. nobody knows anything at this point and those that do are probably covered in NDAs .

Graphically I don't expect a huge step up from RDR. RDR had the advantage of wide open spaces and well you've seen the trailer. What's impressive is the design and the way it moves, not the amount of polygons and pixels being pushed onto the screen. In terms of size, I don't know. They can cram a pretty big map onto one disc, so that's not the problem. But what's big if it's all copy paste design, zombie AI and no gameplay? I'd happily trade in a couple of city blocks and polygons for more missions, activities, general interactivity, interiors, smarter peds etc. So for me it's not so much how far can they go. It's how close can they get? What I've seen from the trailer that's where r* is spending the effort, as usual. Who cares if your glass is refractive and the rims reflective if all the characters look and move like wooden puppets?

[mkey82]

Some good points, but 1300MB of mostly badly encoded audio is really not much to work with. Compare that 1.3GB with the general textures+models data; there is probably some story related stuff there as well, but you'd have a hard time to put even one whole city like PC LC on one DVD. 1.3GB is not even 10% of the total install size.

I'll just have to assume that this time around they're probably going to use better audio compression for speech and music (sounds compression probably incurs some performance penalty) but if they want to expand the map it will mean less texture diversity. If the map is not going to be LS only, then I expect it will contain LS+countryside on one disk and the remaining towns on the other which should leave enough head room for texture diversity and swapping disks shouldn't be that big pain in the but nor occur too often.