[TheTrikstar]

Is Neutering our Animals right? To me it shouldn't be done, Why do us humans get to decide if they reproduce or not. Its literally playing God. In a Humans life not being able to reproduce can be a devastating thing, Some choose to but some don't. I have had 2 Cats in my past all neutered. Both of them could easily of created Dozens of kittens. (It wasn't my choice.)

Now here's why people do neuter there animals: So they don't get stuck with dozens of little animals. This could easily be solved: Give them to a loving home.

What are your thoughts on this. Is it right or wrong to decide if they reproduce or not?

[Irviding]

QUOTE (TheTrikstar @ Monday, Feb 13 2012, 17:23)

Is Neutering our Animals right? To me it shouldn't be done, Why do us humans get to decide if they reproduce or not. Its literally playing God. In a Humans life not being able to reproduce can be a devastating thing, Some choose to but some don't. I have had 2 Cats in my past all neutered. Both of them could easily of created Dozens of kittens. (It wasn't my choice.) Now here's why people do neuter there animals: So they don't get stuck with dozens of little animals. This could easily be solved: Give them to a loving home. What are your thoughts on this. Is it right or wrong to decide if they reproduce or not?

Before I respond, just curious, are you pro-choice?

[Jeeebuuus]

I'm an animal lover(well dogs and cats mostly) and I don't really see a problem with it. While we are at it we should be neutering people as well. Too many of you. In fifty years Earths population will be 14 billion if the current rate continues. Thats alot of in the way people. Back on topic, animals in the long run forgive you if you do that to them. That is if they even remember it happening.

[Craig]

Pets don't have the benefit and the convenience of contraception. Okay, so most animals (mammals at least) have sex for the sole purpose of procreation, meaning that their desired outcome is to bear young. Humans, or rather vets, intervene for a number of reasons. My auntie is a cat freak. She has around 6 or 7 that I know of and she struggles to care for those at the best of times, both financially and emotionally. She has had all cats neutered for the sole purpose of quality of life. If she hadn't capped her kitty's balls, she'd have around four or five times the amount of cats she could handle, which would in turn cause problems for everyone. Think of it on this scale, and then think of it on the scale that a woman in her early 20s has four kids because she couldn't keep her legs shut for Jerome or Jonathan or Timothy or whoever. With each careless act, the quality of life decreases for those children depending on the income of the mother, who receives very little support from the father.

It's a little odd to jump from cats to humans, especially offering such a comparison, but it's the same principle. For those that care a great deal about their cats or dogs, sometimes it's a necessity to ensure quality of life is kept constant for all involved. Those unborn animals were never alive. It isn't like they were born and then we've killed them. Even those against abortion can't claim the two are the same. It'd be considered unethical to take the right away from a man or woman to have kids (i.e. the complete removal of testicles or womb without reason) but the difference is we're evolved enough as a society and a collective to know our choices have knock-on effects. Dogs and cats don't, so we often have to make choices we feel are best. At home, you'd look after your cat's litter just as much as they would, if not more, because pets can be fickle parents. With us, the baby is our responsibility just the same.

[AlexGTAGamer]

Every cat my family have had has been neutered.

Not just for the old "It's hard work looking after kittens", but rather for their own safety.

You see my family have never had just one sole cat, we've always had two. So we always neuter our cats so that the other cat doesn't get agressive and harm the kittens of the other one (as the cats we've had always tend to have a temper).

My brother has a cat called Target and see had kittens, sadly none of them did well.
- One kitten fell out of a window and died.
- Another came to the same fate.
- One was hit by a car.
- The kitten we had from that litter came to the same fate and was hit by a speeding van.
- The only litter to survive was one called Jess who never got on with her mum, and one day she ran away from home and got hit by a car herself.

[*MURDOC*]

I guess you're not considering how much birth can take out of an animal, especially after multiple births, death of the mother can actually be fairly common with certain animals, especially considering how many babies can be in a single litter, it's a lot of stress on the mother.
I'm not even going to mention injuries and such that can occur even just during the mating process.

Another aspect I think you fail to consider is how difficult it can be to give a dozen small animals to loving homes, it's not always as simple as you make it sound.

QUOTE

Its literally playing God.

Sort of like the way we tend to breed specific animals together to create a new creature with the traits we've chosen for it?

Labradoodle anyone?

This post has been edited by *MURDOC* on Tuesday, Feb 14 2012, 19:09

[d0mm2k8]

QUOTE (TheTrikstar @ Monday, Feb 13 2012, 23:23)

Its literally playing God.

If a 'God' didn't want us doing this stuff it wouldn't give us the power and tools to do so. But let's not get into that.

QUOTE

Why do us humans get to decide if they reproduce or not.

Because if it were up to the animal, it would be to reproduce almost every single time, and that wouldn't really benefit us would it? I mean, a 'loving home' isn't as available as you may think it is with these shelters being full of homeless animals and what not. There is also very little chance for them to become extinct since we are the ones who breed them in the first place and control their population almost directly.

Also, as far as I know, sex is extremely painful for female cats when the male pulls out due to small barbs on the males penis pulling at her insides. Some say it is even excruciatingly painful for the female.

[GTA_stu]

QUOTE (d0mm2k8 @ Tuesday, Feb 14 2012, 19:57)

Also, as far as I know, sex is extremely painful for female cats when the male pulls out due to small barbs on the males penis pulling at her insides. Some say it is even excruciatingly painful for the female.

I'd like to hear the explanation from the scientist who discoved that...

OT:

QUOTE

Now here's why people do neuter there animals: So they don't get stuck with dozens of little animals. This could easily be solved: Give them to a loving home.

It could be, if there was the demand for them. But unfortunately it's just not there. Shelters are already overcrowded, what does that tell you? There's just too many cats and dogs out there and not enough homes for them. Animal shelters can only house a certain amount, when they can't take any more then the animals have to get euthanised anyways. How is that a better outcome?

You're right to an extent, but what's wrong with that? Why should people be forced to look after a litter of kittens or puppies? The responsible thing to do is neuter your animals and then you don't have that problem. There is a solution to that problem without neutering, it's called a bin bag and a canal. Again, how is that a better outcome?

[Irviding]

QUOTE (*MURDOC* @ Tuesday, Feb 14 2012, 14:04)

Sort of like the way we tend to breed specific animals together to create a new creature with the traits we've chosen for it? Labradoodle anyone?

Not even that, but the modern dog really doesn't even exist in nature. We've been breeding them for thousands of years and created what we see today. I find this notion that the animal we have in our house is this sacred creature of mother nature that has never been violated to just be ridiculous. It's a dog. It's your property. It's not capable of human action. Does that mean you can do anything you want to your dog? No, absolutely not. When it comes to hurting it a little bit in order to look out for its greater good, what's the problem?

[Vercetti27]

playing god? seeing as no-one else can do it I'm guessing we might as well be the ones to play god. I don't like the idea of doing that to animals though , its not as if they go around looking for it all the time.

[*MURDOC*]

QUOTE (Vercetti27 @ Wednesday, Feb 15 2012, 03:16)

...its not as if they go around looking for it all the time.

You've obviously never met Hank, my friends Boxer...


Here's a tip, don't wear shorts around Hank.

QUOTE

Not even that, but the modern dog really doesn't even exist in nature. We've been breeding them for thousands of years and created what we see today.

Yeah no sh*t, what the f*ck did you think I was referring to?

[Viperman]

Well I had two cats, both unchopped. I was always on the "you cant chop his manly hood of" side of the fence.

But wee guy kept running off, not seeing him for weeks at a time. Then, he never came home at all. It was sad and devastating to me. Luckily though, he got her pregnant before dissappearing.

She had 4 kittens, 2 males identical to thier dad, 2 almost identical to the mother.
We got them all neutered, 4 kittens and thier mum. More to stop them wandering tbh. Thier now about 1 year 6 months now.

So is it right or wrong? Well, I think the fact that feral cats would only live 3-5 years max, and I expect to have mines until thier 15, then yeah its right. We are maybe choosing to stop them breeding, but were also giving them a loving, long, happy life. I also feel thier is not enough animal lovers to take all the youngs in, and giving the choice, I would prefer to see life quality over quantity of them.

[Chunkyman]

I think it's good to neuter your pets, because having a dozen kittens to take care of is too difficult and animal shelters are packed enough.

Also, finding people to take them in can be hard. I think that neutering is a good way to save yourself and the hypothetical kittens a lot of trouble.

As for whether it's right to do it, well I don't believe animals have rights.

This post has been edited by Chunkyman on Wednesday, Feb 15 2012, 22:28

[Irviding]

QUOTE (*MURDOC* @ Wednesday, Feb 15 2012, 10:42)

Yeah no sh*t, what the f*ck did you think I was referring to?

Calm your horsey... I wasn't going after you I was supplementing your point

Anyway, I do think animals have rights to some point. I mean you can't just torture your pets... they can feel and have emotion.

[*MURDOC*]

I didn't actually mean for it to sound that hostile, lol.

[SagaciousKJB]

Well, let's look at cats for a moment...

Let's say you don't neuter your cat, it gets out, and impregnates a stray. The stray has a littler of 8 cats, who in two years can have a litter of 8 on their own. In the mean time, the same stray cat can have another litter of 8 before the first one even reaches breeding age--if I remember correctly they can have a litter once every couple of months. So let's say that in a year one cat produces 24 other cats, each of which may go on to have 8 or so kittens of their own, or impregnate another female cat that can have 8 of their own... You can start to see that the population of strays can skyrocket.

When you get huge numbers of stray cats like this, you get problems. They will get under peoples' homes, cause health problems amongst themselves, and when you're talking about a stray population of thousands of cats trying to rely on a low amount of resources, the actual lives of the cats themselves is not great and that's before you even start factoring in the cost on human life.

Past that, a lot of animals live longer after being spayed or neutered, because the reproductive "instincts" are stressful on animals. Sex is really not the same for animals as it is for humans. It is a very disturbing urge that they feel they must "relieve". So in all actuality you're really improving their quality of life by removing this urge to procreate.

Besides, as someone else already pointed out, pets like the modern dog are pretty much entire creations of humanity. They are domesticated. We've already played god by creating breeds that could not live without us. Most modern breed of dog will die or live very poorly on their own. Cats are a little bit better off and will survive and thrive without the aid of humans, but as their population grows and their resources dwindle the quality of life amongst them decreases dramatically. Not enough food, not enough warm places to sleep, the spread of disease and illness increases, etc.

At the end of the day we play God when we have taken these breeds of animals and domesticated them over so many years to live along side of us. They are dependent on us to take care of them, and spaying and neutering is generally a better idea. Unless you're going to actually breed your animals, just letting them live with their urges to procreate is more cruel than not.

[goin-god]

QUOTE (Irviding @ Wednesday, Feb 15 2012, 22:30)

QUOTE (*MURDOC* @ Wednesday, Feb 15 2012, 10:42) Yeah no sh*t, what the f*ck did you think I was referring to? Calm your horsey... I wasn't going after you I was supplementing your point Anyway, I do think animals have rights to some point. I mean you can't just torture your pets... they can feel and have emotion.

Who said it was ok to torture them? Neutering is not torturing if done right.

[Irviding]

I know, goin-god. What I meant was the notion that animals have no rights at all is something I don't really agree with.

[Guns N R0se]

QUOTE (AlexGTAGamer @ Tuesday, Feb 14 2012, 16:08)

My brother has a cat called Target and see had kittens, sadly none of them did well. - One kitten fell out of a window and died. - Another came to the same fate. - One was hit by a car. - The kitten we had from that litter came to the same fate and was hit by a speeding van. - The only litter to survive was one called Jess who never got on with her mum, and one day she ran away from home and got hit by a car herself.

What the...

[sivispacem]

QUOTE (Guns N R0se @ Saturday, Feb 18 2012, 06:49)

QUOTE (AlexGTAGamer @ Tuesday, Feb 14 2012, 16:08) My brother has a cat called Target and see had kittens, sadly none of them did well. - One kitten fell out of a  window and died. - Another came to the same fate. - One was hit by a car. - The kitten we had from that litter came to the same fate and was hit by a speeding van. - The only litter to survive was one called Jess who never got on with her mum, and one day she ran away from home and got hit by a car herself. What the...

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