Excuse me? All I'm doing is pointing about the complete and total lack of veracity of your sourcing. Do you see how all I have to do is come here and spam saying "Nope I know people there who say differently" to convey what you're conveying? You've yet to produce any proof other than A) nazi style propaganda coming out of Syria, or B) claims of knowing people who tell you what is happening.
Sorry - but that don't fly my friend. If you've ever been to college, or high school for that measure, you'd know that claiming you know a guy over there isn't enough to disprove entire news networks, the United Nations, the Arab League, thousands of amateur videos, etc. If you've ever taken a semester of forensics or criminalistics, you're taught day one that a camera cannot lie. When you pick up Syrian soldiers executing people on the street solely because they protest, we have a problem.
That's because i know your lying. And you aren't even Middle-Eastern anyways so even if you know 1 or 2 people, it doesn't matter. I have FAMILY who is Syrian. My best mates here are Syrian. Our closest friends are Syrian. ALL have the same things to say about the situation!
You've never been to the country. You don't know how it was like before all this.ALL you know about Syria is what the media has told you. Visit the country and you will witness the truth. You ignorant Americans are so annoying.
I have given you a scenario. No response by you. I'm assuming Obama's response would be similar to Assad's.
I love UAVs Group: Andolini Mafia Family
Joined: Nov 6, 2008
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 22:55)
QUOTE (Irviding @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 03:43)
Excuse me? All I'm doing is pointing about the complete and total lack of veracity of your sourcing. Do you see how all I have to do is come here and spam saying "Nope I know people there who say differently" to convey what you're conveying? You've yet to produce any proof other than A) nazi style propaganda coming out of Syria, or B) claims of knowing people who tell you what is happening.
Sorry - but that don't fly my friend. If you've ever been to college, or high school for that measure, you'd know that claiming you know a guy over there isn't enough to disprove entire news networks, the United Nations, the Arab League, thousands of amateur videos, etc. If you've ever taken a semester of forensics or criminalistics, you're taught day one that a camera cannot lie. When you pick up Syrian soldiers executing people on the street solely because they protest, we have a problem.
That's because i know your lying.
You've never been to the country. You don't know how it was like before all this.ALL you know about Syria is what the media has told you. Visit the country and you will witness the truth. You ignorant Americans are so annoying.
I have given you a scenario. No response by you. I'm assuming Obama's response would be similar to Assad's.
I know you're lying. How do I know you've been to Syria? How do I know you know these people? Do you see how f*cking stupid you sound?
That scenario is irrelevant. In Syria, you can't protest the government peacefully. In the US, you can. Your scenario is a load of bullsh*t because the government would not go and murder unarmed, peaceful protestors here. They've only armed themselves after they've been systematically executed. 70 dead protestors today - how do you feel that you are sitting here defending this piece of sh*t regime?
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 22:55)
QUOTE (Irviding @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 03:43)
Excuse me? All I'm doing is pointing about the complete and total lack of veracity of your sourcing. Do you see how all I have to do is come here and spam saying "Nope I know people there who say differently" to convey what you're conveying? You've yet to produce any proof other than A) nazi style propaganda coming out of Syria, or B) claims of knowing people who tell you what is happening.
Sorry - but that don't fly my friend. If you've ever been to college, or high school for that measure, you'd know that claiming you know a guy over there isn't enough to disprove entire news networks, the United Nations, the Arab League, thousands of amateur videos, etc. If you've ever taken a semester of forensics or criminalistics, you're taught day one that a camera cannot lie. When you pick up Syrian soldiers executing people on the street solely because they protest, we have a problem.
That's because i know your lying.
You've never been to the country. You don't know how it was like before all this.ALL you know about Syria is what the media has told you. Visit the country and you will witness the truth. You ignorant Americans are so annoying.
I have given you a scenario. No response by you. I'm assuming Obama's response would be similar to Assad's.
I know you're lying. How do I know you've been to Syria? How do I know you know these people? Do you see how f*cking stupid you sound?
WHY THE f*ck WOULD I WASTE MY f*ckING TIME ON THIS IF IT WAS FAKE.
Not everybody lives a sad life like you and has time to write up fake sh*t online. I saw a thread which i know a lot about and put in my views to help educate people on the truth.
Unfortunately for people like you, unless it matches what your media tells you, it must be false.
Don't believe i know Syrians? Give me a text (that cannot be copied/pdf scan) that is Syrian and i will translate it for you in seconds.
Also, read what i wrote. People protest PEACEFULLY but the government doesn't step down. Then it escalates violently.
This post has been edited by GTAknowledge on Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 04:03
Shoot Looters, Hang Pirates! Group: Members
Joined: Dec 25, 2006
There comes a time when two people seize the forum just to say, "YOU'RE WRONG". Neither have 'real' Proof of what they say/assert. So That's the time to stop the Tail Chasing. If you can't go for the neck (Kill) and are merely repeating yourselves. You Don't need to say anymore. Stop Repeating what has already been said. We Know It Already.
Pick up the Argument when you Have Something NEW to say.
Yeah, sorry - we're done here my friend. You've pretty much completely proven here that you lack all credibility.
I feel so sorry for you (serious). I bet if CNN came out tomorrow and said everything i said, you would believe.
Well, you refused to answer what Obama would do in a violent revolution.
I also offered you a way of proof of my Middle-Eastern ties. Whether it be showing me an online text (PDF which can't be copied and pasted), or getting your fake Syrian friend to write some things on a paper and photocopy it for me to read and prove my background.
If it makes you sleep better at night thinking i'm wrong and your media is right, then so be it. Hopefully the truth will be given to you by your overlord media for you to one day see.
You know how much I hate youtube, but maybe that'll get through to you. Pay careful attention to the people in the second one - they don't look to violent, yet they are gassed and beat down by authorities.
You know how much I hate youtube, but maybe that'll get through to you. Pay careful attention to the people in the second one - they don't look to violent, yet they are gassed and beat down by authorities.
You like that? You like to see murdered corpses from the animal you support?
You like that man? Look at those battered and dead faces. They deserve it for protesting. Want me to find some more corpses for you?
Vid 1: Proof that they were killed by Assad forces?
Vid 2: Tear gass is used everywhere to break up riots. Just 2 days ago it was used in your country:
Vid 3: Again, proof it was Assad forces apart from the title? All they are saying is "Allah Akbaar". No mention or visuals indicating Assad forces.
Picture: Proof they were "innocent" people?
And to show you what your great Western funded rebels are up to:
Innocent Christian girl killed by the extremist Muslim rebels:
Rebels dumping dead Police men bodies into the river (has been confirmed as dead Police as many bodies were recovered and funerals held):
More dead innocent Soldiers being thrown into the river (it's like a ritual to the rebels):
The police AND civilians are running away from rebels. The civilian is shot and likely killed but the police man still doesn't leave him behind:
Tortured, raped and hanged. An innocent Police man after being abducted. This rebels are SOOOO peaceful.
Family killed by rebels (show to someone Arabic for confirmation. Subtitles are correct):
NOTE:
- Many videos showing supposed "Assad" forces are fake. The rebels do have some defectors and have been caught numerous times faking videos for propaganda purposes. - I DO NOT SUPPORT Assad's violence and have stated many times many mistakes were made. BUT, what the rebels are doing is beyond terrorism. They have NO reason to kill innocent people, soldiers or police men. Assad's target is the rebels. The rebels target is every civilian they see. - To prove my videos are not fake, show them to Arabic people you know. The things they say expose who they are.
Anyone interested in a non-bias article should read this:
Why is the Syrian opposition so divided? Here are some of the main divisions running through Syrian society:
Sunni versus Alawi Poor versus rich Rural versus urban Homs and Hama versus Aleppo and Damascus Baathists versus Non-Baathists Religious versus Secular Saudi Arabia versus Iran USA versus Russia
Welcome to the cocktail of the new Syrian revolution.
I returned home to Syria two weeks ago. Many of my friends were surprised that I would make the long trip at this time of gathering war.
For two weeks, I traveled (flew) between Aleppo and Damascus. I talked to rich and poor: bankers, taxi drivers, young protestors from Idlib, rank and file army soldiers stationed in Homs, senior Alawi officers, Christian and tribal Sunni families. I did my best to get a comprehensive view of what people were thinking and how they saw the future.
In what follows, I will present a raw interview-type account of three different encounters that I had. Two were with Taxi drivers. One with a soldier. Even though I had my own car and someone to drive me around, I preferred the taxis to get a better feel.
The First Encounter:
Perhaps the most telling single discussion I had was with a young smart university graduate from Idlib who was driving a taxi which he does not own. Within minutes of his discovering that I lived abroad, he boasted to me that he had taken part in two demonstrations in his home town, Idlib. We arrived at our destination in minutes, but I ask him to keep the meter running. For the next 45 minutes, we talk about the revolution while his car was parked outside my house. Here is a synopsis of our conversation:
Ehsani: Why are you protesting?
He started by describing how his first cousin was killed with 23 other cadets while in service. They were suspected of turning their backs on the army. He described how his village has since gone crazy. He then wonders why I would even ask such a question and proceeds to describe how he is unable to get employed. He calmly talks about corruption and cronyism and how they have infested the ruling party and the business elites. The Aleppo merchants are only interested in money and are in no mood to join the uprising he thought. When he appeared in those Idlib demonstrations, what was the army’s response I wondered? “They just watched,” he said. “I am not going to lie and tell you that they shoot at us.”
“What does the President have to do to gain your support from this point?” I ask. “It is too late. There is nothing” came the quick response”. How long will it take for the revolution to succeed and topple the regime? Four years came the quick response. Naturally, I act surprised. He makes a bet with me that it will be this long. The four years are needed before the country is truly starving and when even the 8-year old is forced to go down onto the streets to join the protests. “Only then, will the regime fall,” was his explanation. He has a facebook page and he urges me to communicate with him to understand more about the revolution after I leave.
The Second Encounter:
The next day, I hear that there is a pro-regime maseera (demonstration) under way. I spend two full hours in the city square in an attempt to understand who the participants are. I quickly realize that the Baath party is largely in charge. It is cold but most young men are asked to make a large circle and dance the dabke. On the other side of the street, groups with a loud speaker are rallying the crowd with songs praising the President and attacking the Emir of Qatar Hamad Al-kalb (the dog). The Syrian TV is present. Reporters are busy handing their own cell phones to people in the crowd asking them what they think. Many grab the phones and launch into a tirade against the Arab league and Emir Hamad while they urge the government to hit the insurgents hard. An important person must have arrived. He is surrounded by tough looking men pushing the crowd. I turn to one of them and wonder who this man is. “Ameen Al Hizb” was the quick response. The VIP makes it to the front of the Massera and listens to the Hamad references, smiles and heads back to his awaiting car in the distance. One last dabke group is left. A group of 7 girls arrive. They are distinctly unattractive. They first join the young boys in the dabke circle. They then form their own mini circle in the middle. Another tough looking man seems to be in charge of this young debke crowd. The square is emptying out as it starts to rain. I decide to grab a taxi. Benzene is not available again it seems. A shortage of taxis is evident. One shows up and only decides to take me when he finds out that my house is on his way home. No Benzene again I ask? He nods and tells me how he will drop me, head home and park the car. Then what will you do I wonder? He quickly snaps back “I will beg”.
Ehsani: How many kids do you have? Answer: Three
Where are you originally from?
Answer: Afreen
Are you a Kurd? Yes.
Are you a naturalized Syrian citizen? Yes.
Ehsani: How much do you need to live a decent life with three kids?
Answer: SYP 20,000 ($285 with SYP at 70 to the Dollar that morning).
Ehsani: How much do you make?
Answer: SYP 15,000 but I pay SYP 4800 in mortgage leaving me with about SYP 10,000 to cover everything for 5 people for a month. I quickly do the math in my head. This is about $ 1 a day per person.
Ehsani: I wonder how you manage. What do your kids demand the most when you get home?
Driver: Farrouj (chicken) which costs SYP 350.
I have three kids myself. The trip is over. I pull out a large money note and hand it to him if he promises that he buys two chickens on his way home after he drops me off. He is shell shocked and tries to refuse it. I insist but only if he keeps his promise to buy the farrouj for the kids.
The Third Encounter:
I get a call from a relative telling me how a young man in his building just came back from serving in Homs. He is allowed to see his family for three days before he needs to return. I ask if I can talk to him. That evening, a 20-year old shows up. He starts by showing me pictures with him in uniform as he sits on the front line of two warring communities in Homs. For the next 30 minutes, he describes how Alawi and Sunni neighborhoods face each other with his unit sitting in between. Both are heavily armed he claims. He seems resigned to the fact that the country faces a long ordeal as sectarian tensions mount. He is a Christian serving with 5 Sunnis. He assures me that the Syrian army is a lot stronger than many believe and that only 10-20% of its capacity has been used thus far.
Ehsani: If Damascus decides to end the Homs insurgency and use its full might, how many people would die?
Soldier: 50,000
Ehsani: What about all of Syria?
Soldier: 100,000. Presently, we have orders not to shoot. We gain little by shooting as the guns will be grabbed by others and the anger will ensure that many more join the revolution. Our unit is one of the weakest. Damascus could easily replace us with stronger divisions if the objective were to take over these neighborhoods and kill the armed elements. This is what I expect will happen at some stage, however.
Ehsani: What will you do once you are done with your service?
Soldier: “Get out of here as fast as I can. I don’t care where I go.” His cousin is sitting next to him nods in agreement. “I will swim across to Cyprus soon,” he adds.
The Aleppo Business Community:
The following morning I accompany my father to the heart of the Aleppo business world. From a nondescript “dekkane” (store), super astute men seem to run an operation with a turnover of nearly $20 million a year. Forget about fancy offices or executive secretaries. This is how generations of this family have conducted business – under the radar screen. How many men make up the extended family with the same family name, I ask? Nearly 5,000 I am told.
Ehsani: What has stopped the Aleppo business community from joining the uprising?
Store owner: In Aleppo, the people are wise. They are not interested in taking the country into the majhoul (unknown). We are not interested in sulta (ruling). We want stability.
Ehsani: How much of what is going on in the country is due to sectarian tensions between Sunnis like yourselves and Alawis?
Store owner: We really don’t care who is ruling the country. We care about stability and justice. We are not happy with the corruption and injustice. He then asked me if I had visited the Aleppo court system. The corruption there is mind boggling, I am quickly told. Judges pay between SYP 5 and 10 million to get the job. Every case can be negotiated and priced with his “kateb” (clerk) outside. Many times, individuals who have committed murder can walk away after a short sentence if they pay enough and change the sentence down from capital punishment (iidam). Many operatives in the court have witnesses for hire at their disposal. With enough money, you can buy any testimony-shahade.
As I leave, one man describes how tribal infighting will take this country down the tubes should the regime fall and law and order disappears. You have no idea how much vengeance (tarat) exists between our ashaer (tribes) here in Aleppo, I am reminded.
On the Economy:
The economy is reeling after nearly a year of unrest. To be sure, this is not surprising. During the early months, the local currency was largely stable. The Syrian Central Bank has always used the stable currency exchange rate as a metric of its successful management of the economy. Or, so they thought. For years, everyone was comfortable that the SYP will stay within a reasonable range thanks to ample foreign exchange reserves and a willingness to intervene when needed. This long-held assumption was severely tested as of late. The SYP has by now lost nearly 50% of its value against the Dollar. The Central bank has been powerless to stop it. No one in the country has offered an explanation. People are totally in the dark. For example, It is impossible to know the exact level of reserves at the Central Bank. This number is a national security matter. Logically, the political leadership has realized that this is a long ordeal which dictates that it is perhaps better off holding on to whatever reserves it has rather than wasting them on a futile currency intervention.
The recent devaluation to SYP 73 (the rate earlier today) has caused havoc in the business community. Most sellers of goods and commodities refuse to sell inventories unless they adjust the prices to the new rate. This is why prices have nearly doubled as talk of SYP at 100 makes the rounds. A prominent businessman describes how his local sheikh urged him and others to sell their old inventories at the old exchange rate which was his true cost. He was torn about what to do at first but then decided to ignore the advice and sell at the higher prices to reflect the new exchange rate. The exchange rate of the SYP is now nearly every household’s discussion. Every social meeting starts with the latest rate from an hour ago. The economy is entering a dollarization phase. For any commercial transaction to take place, finding where the latest exchange rate is comes first. As the effects of this currency devaluation filter through, prices at the retail level are likely to head higher. The government does not seem to have the resources to increase the salaries this time. Those on fixed incomes are being crushed.
Concluding Remarks:
According to one of my dear friends, it is impossible to model the final outcome of this crisis. What will happen to the regime and whether it will survive is impossible to forecast. One particularly astute observer assured me that the regime cannot last beyond the end of this year. Again, the person who stuck in my head the most was the young student from Idlib. Indeed, every Syrian who is in the military or who has served there in the past seemed to believe that it will be “years” before the regime is weakened enough to lose. This sentiment was shared by even those in the opposition that I spoke to. Syrians inside the country seem to be well aware of the might of the Syrian army and the security services. Perhaps this is why the hardcore elements of the opposition are pleading for foreign intervention. I think that it is highly unlikely that the regime will lose to the opposition without some form of foreign intervention and/or the Russians turning their back. Niether appears to be on the horizon.
Talk of corruption and cronyism were on everyone’s lips. This subject has been the source of much of the anger that motivates the opposition. On the last day of my visit to Syria, I heard an analogy to describe the present condition of the regime that struck me as particularly apt. It went like this:
Bashar is driving a bus packed with passengers. Many have been on that bus for years. Those closest to him occupy the front rows of the bus. The uprising is about new faces who also want to board the packed bus. But, for them to jump in, the driver has to throw some of the current passengers of the bus to make room. Bashar looks in the rear view mirror. Who should he pick to throw off the bus? The old Baathists? Members of the Qiyadeh al-Qutriya (The Baath Regional Leadership)? Members of the family? But those are the people who have stuck with him and helped him survive for nearly a year when few gave him a chance. Does it make any sense to throw aside his loyalists and let in new faces who are publicly asking for his head? Any rationale driver will stay the course as he realizes that changing the driver and turning over the whole bus are the true motivations of his enemies.
During one extremely interesting gathering, I was struck by how politically savvy nearly every Syrian has become. The most interesting and passionate remarks I had heard on this trip came from the women who I met. During this same dinner, I asked what if anything could Bashar have done differently?
“When the opposition wanted the regime to pull back a step, he should have pulled back four. With the extra space at their disposal, there was more room for them to debate and argue amongst each other leaving the leadership with more time and breathing space to contemplate their next move”.
I know that I speak for 23 million other Syrians when I worry about where this country is heading. Years ago, I used to speak of buckling our seat belts. Since the crisis started, I have referred to the country having entered a long black tunnel. As we approach the first year anniversary of these events, I wonder where in the dark tunnel we find ourselves. My pessimistic nature tells me that we are still at its beginning.
This post has been edited by GTAknowledge on Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 05:33
I love UAVs Group: Andolini Mafia Family
Joined: Nov 6, 2008
Sorry for the quick response since I'm on my cell, but can you at least recognize that this started because the Assad government denied these protestors the right to protest? It's evidently clear that both sides have been wrong, but it's also pretty clear that the greater offender is the government here.
Isn't all this a moot point anyway? From what I understand, the rebels have very few numbers and have not been able to significantly dent the apparatus of Assad's government. They've taken over a few suburbs, nothing more. Yes, certain members of the army have defected, but it is not a situation such as we saw in Libya, where rebels and government forces gained and lost cities on a daily basis. This is not yet a revolution or a civil war. It is still just a tiny, almost insignificant revolt. And the Arab League will happily sit on their hands until it has been quashed. The rebels have made it clear that they do not want Western help, and the only other group they've appealed to just walked away. I think they're completely screwed, Assad's not going anywhere. This guy is smarter than Gaddafi, he doesn't rant and rave, he does things quietly and efficiently. I would like him removed, because he is one of Iran's last remaining allies, and his fall may encourage further protests against the Islamist regime in Tehran. But I do not see his downfall as inevitable at this point. The rebels have zero momentum.
Sorry for the quick response since I'm on my cell, but can you at least recognize that this started because the Assad government denied these protestors the right to protest? It's evidently clear that both sides have been wrong, but it's also pretty clear that the greater offender is the government here.
This is my general understanding of the events overall:
The first few small protests had no military presence. A man burnt himself alive and others began painting words (graffiti) illegally on public places for change. Their was always illegal things being done. Whether it be the graffiti or breaking shop windows and disrupting public areas.
At this point the Police stepped in and began using tear gas and other things to break up the protests and try and make them smaller and less chaotic. This protests then turned to riots as more people joined. This was around February/March, 2011. At this point the riot squads began arresting people who committed any crimes or came to the protests with weapons. Assad has since pardoned over 5000 of these people with no charges made.
As the protests grew more violent towards the police, the military was called in to assist because the protestors began to be violent at police. Yes, some people were killed by the military but mistakes were admitted and no command to kill was ever given. These were individual cases and investigations have begun into who those soldiers were.
The protestors then began to throw rocks at the military, then flares and then it escalated quickly and turned to protestors firing at police with guns. This went on for a few months. The rioters would mix themselves with protestors and then fire randomly at the army thinking they would get away with it. The army would fire back and kill some innocent people, but at the same time kill the armed protestors committing the crimes.
Then it began to get serious. Dangerous weapons which were smuggled in through Lebanon , Turkey and Iraq (borders not heavily guarded) and armed gangs began to form. At this point also, some Syrian soldiers defected and joined these newly formed gangs. They call themselves the "Free Syrian Army". Their goal was to target the military and ruin their strength.
It escalated even more when armed gangs from difference countries linked to Al-Qaeda (like the Libyan rebels) began to cross the boarder and join the opposition. At this point, it wasn't just the military who the rebels were after, but they also kidnapped, raped, tortured and killed (see videos in previous post) innocent soldiers, police men and civilians. They began to take over towns and use them to store weapons and plan bombings.
And here we are now. The military VS armed terrorist rebels.
Things to note:
- In multiple speeches, Assad has offered peaceful change of policies and the way the country is governed. But the rebels reject this because their goal now is not to help everyday Syrians (obviously not because they are killing them), but to take control of the country for them selves. They want power, not freedom. The protestors may want freedom, but that is not the goal of the rebels.
- I admit the Military may have overacted, even though no command was given to kill. Assad is not 100% right in this situation, but at this moment, he is greatly favored over the extremist Muslims who want to take over.
Wilderness of Mirrors Group: The Connection
Joined: Feb 14, 2011
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
1. I'm am simply forwarding information i have been told by people in the middle of this. I do agree that the Military has been too violent in some circumstances, but you have to understand that their country has been invaded by terrorists. Nobody is safe like they were 1 year ago. Those various organizations are not always accurate. I can't just call my family in Syria liars because some organization released information which contradicts their story. Not everything in the media is wrong. Some i agree with. But a lot of it only shows one side of the story and i am shedding light on the other side.
That doesn't answer my question. I understand that you are "merely forwarding information" but you repeatedly make the mistake of referring to the "media". I'm not using the "media" as a primary source, I'm using organisations whose entire role and mandate is to provide accurate, timely and effective intelligence on violent unrest, terrorism and other such acts in foreign nations for the purposes of informing businesses and government policy. I appreciate that those various organisations are individually "not always accurate" but as a group, the chance of all of them getting it immeasurably wrong consecutively whilst having a greater understanding and organisations involvement in what's occurring in Syria is extremely low. I'm not asking whether you think they're wrong, I'm asking how you can quantify it. As for showing "one side of the story"; well in the case of the media you're correct, but not in the case of, for instance, private sector intelligence providers. Why would they lie? They've got no government agenda, in fact spreading untruths would be actively harmful to their profitability as they're entire business model is based on getting things right. You can't argue bias in cases like that because it's in every imaginable interest they have to "tell it like it is", as it were. I don't want to get onto the whole "whose source is better" argument but I see absolutely no reason why organisations like this would present falsehoods when it's in their interest not to.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
2. Will keep this simple. The Libyan rebels were linked to Al-Qaeda: Top Libyan Rebel Leader Has Deep Al Qaeda Ties They have also been seen holding the Al-Qaeda flag in fights and it appeared after the war on the parliament house.
QUOTE (Forsvarsakademiets Forlag's Dr. Bruce St John)
Overwhelmingly Sunni Muslim, the Libyan people are conservative in outlook and religious in nature, but they have never shown any real appetite for the radical Islam advocated by Al-Qaeda or its North African affiliate, Al-Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb (AQIM). Granted, Libyan nationals made up the second largest group of foreign fighters in Iraq after the Saudis; however, their opposition to the invasion and occupation of Iraq does not in itself portend an Islamist threat in Libya. A related and more likely prospect is that some of the arms liberated from government arms depots could end up in the hands of AQIM supporters in neighboring states, like Algeria. Much has also been made of the presence of several former Guantanamo detainees in the rebel ranks; however, they appear to be fighting as individual citizens and not as an organized group.(16) There may be some public sympathy – even admiration – for these Islamist figures, but there appears to be little public interest in an Islamist alternative to the non-ideological February 17th Revolution.
If there was such an intrinsic link between al-Qaeda and the Libyan rebels, then why were they unable to procure an al-Qaeda flag of the recent design, instead resorting to one from almost 15 years ago?
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
I've seen lots of reference to "600 Libyan mercenaries" in Syria, but they all come back to the same source. I've not seen any independent verification of it. In fact, I've seen more independent verification of Syrian mercenaries engaged in attacks in Libya (requires signing up) than I have vice versa. And anyway, "mercenary" is someone who fights for personal profit. It's not synonymous with "terrorist" as you seem to imply.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
Also, this is RAW footage of a protest with Anti-Assad protestors and many rebels. The Al-Qaeda flag is clearly seen being waved in the crowd:
That demonstrates absolutely nothing. There have been al-Qaeda flags waved at marches in the United Kingdom. That doesn't mean that all of those involved in said marches are intrinsically linked with al-Qaeda. That's what your argument here amounts to.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
3. There are a few hundred Libyan rebels fighting there now.
So says you, I've not seen any verification of it. All the pages and reports highlighting this figure point back to Al-Ra'i Al-Arabi as the source of information. Now the Al-Ra'i name is shared amongst a whole range of Arab news networks, from Jordan to Kuwait. So that's pretty unhelpful. In fact, a brief dig around the subject suggests that yes, Al-Ra'i of Jordan did publish some articles to that end, but these articles clearly state that the Syrian government were the primary source for reports of militants entering the country from Libya. Now, doesn't that smell fishy to you? Even more fishy is that the only relation to " Al-Rai Al-Arabi", rather than "Al-Ra'i" comes in relation to articles which in one way or another denounce the rebels in Syria. I wonder why that it? I'll tell you why- Al-Rai in this instance appears to be a Syrian news channel which was vocal in their support for the Assad regime, condemned US and general Western policy in the region and even gave Gaddafi a voice whilst he was fleeing towards Niger.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
I can not really verify the rest, but when they have interviews on TV, there are black fighters in the background. A lot of them are black. And Syrians are not black. Also my family and friends who experienced these situations have told me they saw people who were "sood - سود" (which is black in Arabic). I will try and find some of these videos and report back about that if i do find some.
Oh, and that's somehow proof that they're Libyan? Correct me if I'm wrong (which I'm not), but the majority of Libyans are Arab, no? Something like 98% of Libyans are Berber or Arab in descent. In fact, Libya has proportionally more "Arab" citizens than Syria does. Also, black Africans in Libya were on the receiving end of many of the alleged incidents of violence against Gaddafi loyalists? Now, doesn't it seem slightly odd to you that this same section of the population, who by many accounts were vilified for providing support to loyalist forces, would suddenly take up arms to go fight in a foreign land? No, far more likely is that, as was the case in Libya, they're foreign mercenaries from sub-Saharan African states who've been paid to fight on one side or the other. Do you see quite how illogical this sounds?
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
4. The Iraqi border and Turkey borders are easily accessible for anyone to enter illegally. Syria is a big country and cannot protect all it's borders.
So, you're seriously suggesting that Libyan rebels went literally all the way across Egypt, somehow crossed the Red Sea into Saudi Arabia, went through the entirety of either Iraq or Jordan into Syria, with (if the reports are to be believed) a further detour to Turkey? Or are you actually trying to suggest that someone flew 600 armed individuals complete with materiel and military equipment from Libya to Turkey, either over Israel, Syria proper, Saudi Arabia and Iraq, or via a Mediterranean European state as a proxy, without anyone noticing? Or was it an also unnoticed 650 mile boat journey across the Mediterranean that most likely required passing through Egyptian territorial waters?
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
Also, in Lebanon, the Syrian army has demanded the Lebanese government send troops to the border. Many rebels can't set up camp in Syria so they use Iraq or Lebanon. Example:
So you're suggesting that not only are militants slipping over the border from Iraq (South-East) and Lebanon (North-West), they're also making the 300-mile minimum journey across Syria, armed and completely undetected, to the centres of the resistance which are almost universally in South-Western Syria? I don't think so.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
5. Probably fear. Just like the surrendering of many soldiers in Iraq when the war began. They fear being on Assad's side will get them killed later on by the rebels who they think will take over. Luckily, only a small percentage left, and the majority remains loyal to protecting their country.
What about the very vocal members of the Syrian political regime who've defected? What about generals and high-ranking military officers with huge quantities of manpower at their disposal and a mandate for violence? Just brushing it off as "oh, it's fear" may work for the lowliest of soldiers, but it's completely incompatible with the scale and source of defections. What about Imad Ghalioun, a parliamentarian and vocal political figure in Homs, who defected to Egypt? Colonel Riad al-Assad, the leader of the Free Syrian Army? Mahmoud Souleiman Hajj Hamad, the head of the Defence Ministry's inspectorate? Mustafa al-Sheik, a noted scientist and member of the Syrian security forces, whose now a regional commander for the FSA? Salah Eldin Bilal? Imad Ghalioun? Bekir Atacan? All vocal and active members of the Syrian political establishment, all leaving the country and denouncing the regime.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
6. I didn't say he was great and i said he has done many mistakes. But i am confident he is a million times better then terrorist rebels who have committed many more crimes and want to implement a Saudi Arabia like government with Sharia Law. That is much worse.
Sorry, but you've got absolutely no clue what you're talking about. It's utterly laughable that you seem to automatically suggest- without basis or evidence- that not only are the rebels committing attacks against civilians, engaging in rampant violent criminality and god only knows what else, but they're also all Wahhabi or Salafi supporters, Qtubists or at the very least Takfiri? Seriously, you need to provide some evidence for these utterly absurd allegations lest you be laughed at
This post has been edited by sivispacem on Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 12:23
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
1. I'm am simply forwarding information i have been told by people in the middle of this. I do agree that the Military has been too violent in some circumstances, but you have to understand that their country has been invaded by terrorists. Nobody is safe like they were 1 year ago. Those various organizations are not always accurate. I can't just call my family in Syria liars because some organization released information which contradicts their story. Not everything in the media is wrong. Some i agree with. But a lot of it only shows one side of the story and i am shedding light on the other side.
That doesn't answer my question. I understand that you are "merely forwarding information" but you repeatedly make the mistake of referring to the "media". I'm not using the "media" as a primary source, I'm using organisations whose entire role and mandate is to provide accurate, timely and effective intelligence on violent unrest, terrorism and other such acts in foreign nations for the purposes of informing businesses and government policy. I appreciate that those various organisations are individually "not always accurate" but as a group, the chance of all of them getting it immeasurably wrong consecutively whilst having a greater understanding and organisations involvement in what's occurring in Syria is extremely low. I'm not asking whether you think they're wrong, I'm asking how you can quantify it. As for showing "one side of the story"; well in the case of the media you're correct, but not in the case of, for instance, private sector intelligence providers. Why would they lie? They've got no government agenda, in fact spreading untruths would be actively harmful to their profitability as they're entire business model is based on getting things right. You can't argue bias in cases like that because it's in every imaginable interest they have to "tell it like it is", as it were. I don't want to get onto the whole "whose source is better" argument but I see absolutely no reason why organisations like this would present falsehoods when it's in their interest not to.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
2. Will keep this simple. The Libyan rebels were linked to Al-Qaeda: Top Libyan Rebel Leader Has Deep Al Qaeda Ties They have also been seen holding the Al-Qaeda flag in fights and it appeared after the war on the parliament house.
QUOTE (Forsvarsakademiets Forlag's Dr. Bruce St John)
Overwhelmingly Sunni Muslim, the Libyan people are conservative in outlook and religious in nature, but they have never shown any real appetite for the radical Islam advocated by Al-Qaeda or its North African affiliate, Al-Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb (AQIM). Granted, Libyan nationals made up the second largest group of foreign fighters in Iraq after the Saudis; however, their opposition to the invasion and occupation of Iraq does not in itself portend an Islamist threat in Libya. A related and more likely prospect is that some of the arms liberated from government arms depots could end up in the hands of AQIM supporters in neighboring states, like Algeria. Much has also been made of the presence of several former Guantanamo detainees in the rebel ranks; however, they appear to be fighting as individual citizens and not as an organized group.(16) There may be some public sympathy – even admiration – for these Islamist figures, but there appears to be little public interest in an Islamist alternative to the non-ideological February 17th Revolution.
If there was such an intrinsic link between al-Qaeda and the Libyan rebels, then why were they unable to procure an al-Qaeda flag of the recent design, instead resorting to one from almost 15 years ago?
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
I've seen lots of reference to "600 Libyan mercenaries" in Syria, but they all come back to the same source. I've not seen any independent verification of it. In fact, I've seen more independent verification of Syrian mercenaries engaged in attacks in Libya (requires signing up) than I have vice versa. And anyway, "mercenary" is someone who fights for personal profit. It's not synonymous with "terrorist" as you seem to imply.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
Also, this is RAW footage of a protest with Anti-Assad protestors and many rebels. The Al-Qaeda flag is clearly seen being waved in the crowd:
That demonstrates absolutely nothing. There have been al-Qaeda flags waved at marches in the United Kingdom. That doesn't mean that all of those involved in said marches are intrinsically linked with al-Qaeda. That's what your argument here amounts to.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
3. There are a few hundred Libyan rebels fighting there now.
So says you, I've not seen any verification of it. All the pages and reports highlighting this figure point back to Al-Ra'i Al-Arabi as the source of information. Now the Al-Ra'i name is shared amongst a whole range of Arab news networks, from Jordan to Kuwait. So that's pretty unhelpful. In fact, a brief dig around the subject suggests that yes, Al-Ra'i of Jordan did publish some articles to that end, but these articles clearly state that the Syrian government were the primary source for reports of militants entering the country from Libya. Now, doesn't that smell fishy to you? Even more fishy is that the only relation to " Al-Rai Al-Arabi", rather than "Al-Ra'i" comes in relation to articles which in one way or another denounce the rebels in Syria. I wonder why that it? I'll tell you why- Al-Rai in this instance appears to be a Syrian news channel which was vocal in their support for the Assad regime, condemned US and general Western policy in the region and even gave Gaddafi a voice whilst he was fleeing towards Niger.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
I can not really verify the rest, but when they have interviews on TV, there are black fighters in the background. A lot of them are black. And Syrians are not black. Also my family and friends who experienced these situations have told me they saw people who were "sood - سود" (which is black in Arabic). I will try and find some of these videos and report back about that if i do find some.
Oh, and that's somehow proof that they're Libyan? Correct me if I'm wrong (which I'm not), but the majority of Libyans are Arab, no? Something like 98% of Libyans are Berber or Arab in descent. In fact, Libya has proportionally more "Arab" citizens than Syria does. Also, black Africans in Libya were on the receiving end of many of the alleged incidents of violence against Gaddafi loyalists? Now, doesn't it seem slightly odd to you that this same section of the population, who by many accounts were vilified for providing support to loyalist forces, would suddenly take up arms to go fight in a foreign land? No, far more likely is that, as was the case in Libya, they're foreign mercenaries from sub-Saharan African states who've been paid to fight on one side or the other. Do you see quite how illogical this sounds?
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
4. The Iraqi border and Turkey borders are easily accessible for anyone to enter illegally. Syria is a big country and cannot protect all it's borders.
So, you're seriously suggesting that Libyan rebels went literally all the way across Egypt, somehow crossed the Red Sea into Saudi Arabia, went through the entirety of either Iraq or Jordan into Syria, with (if the reports are to be believed) a further detour to Turkey? Or are you actually trying to suggest that someone flew 600 armed individuals complete with materiel and military equipment from Libya to Turkey, either over Israel, Syria proper, Saudi Arabia and Iraq, or via a Mediterranean European state as a proxy, without anyone noticing? Or was it an also unnoticed 650 mile boat journey across the Mediterranean that most likely required passing through Egyptian territorial waters?
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
Also, in Lebanon, the Syrian army has demanded the Lebanese government send troops to the border. Many rebels can't set up camp in Syria so they use Iraq or Lebanon. Example:
So you're suggesting that not only are militants slipping over the border from Iraq (South-East) and Lebanon (North-West), they're also making the 300-mile minimum journey across Syria, armed and completely undetected, to the centres of the resistance which are almost universally in South-Western Syria? I don't think so.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
5. Probably fear. Just like the surrendering of many soldiers in Iraq when the war began. They fear being on Assad's side will get them killed later on by the rebels who they think will take over. Luckily, only a small percentage left, and the majority remains loyal to protecting their country.
What about the very vocal members of the Syrian political regime who've defected? What about generals and high-ranking military officers with huge quantities of manpower at their disposal and a mandate for violence? Just brushing it off as "oh, it's fear" may work for the lowliest of soldiers, but it's completely incompatible with the scale and source of defections. What about Imad Ghalioun, a parliamentarian and vocal political figure in Homs, who defected to Egypt? Colonel Riad al-Assad, the leader of the Free Syrian Army? Mahmoud Souleiman Hajj Hamad, the head of the Defence Ministry's inspectorate? Mustafa al-Sheik, a noted scientist and member of the Syrian security forces, whose now a regional commander for the FSA? Salah Eldin Bilal? Imad Ghalioun? Bekir Atacan? All vocal and active members of the Syrian political establishment, all leaving the country and denouncing the regime.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 16:34)
6. I didn't say he was great and i said he has done many mistakes. But i am confident he is a million times better then terrorist rebels who have committed many more crimes and want to implement a Saudi Arabia like government with Sharia Law. That is much worse.
Sorry, but you've got absolutely no clue what you're talking about. It's utterly laughable that you seem to automatically suggest- without basis or evidence- that not only are the rebels committing attacks against civilians, engaging in rampant violent criminality and god only knows what else, but they're also all Wahhabi or Salafi supporters, Qtubists or at the very least Takfiri? Seriously, you need to provide some evidence for these utterly absurd allegations lest you be laughed at
STOP YOUR RAMBLING lol. Just get to the point and stop extending your sentences with meaningless things. Most of responses were wrong in that you misread or misinterpreted what i said.
1. The media get's it's information from most of the sources you a referring to, yes? I don't trust the media and their lies = i am not going to trust the people who supplied them with lies. Stop believing things you have not seen so easily without questioning them.
So because your sources all say the same thing, you think it is unlikely they are all wrong?
2. I never suggested all the rebels are part of Al-Qaeda. That's a stupid thing to say and you know it. I said Al-Qaeda is involved in this. That is all. And WHOEVER is assisting the Al-Qaeda rebels is therefore assisting in terrorism.
What the design of the Al-Qaeda flag got to do with anything? lol. An Al-Qaeda flag, whether 1 year old or 20 years old, remains an Al-Qaeda flag. Stupid argument point.
3. Watch some Arabic TV. Wait for an interview with rebels. Watch in amazement at seeing black people in the background. Also heaps of dead bodies of rebels have been shown and sometimes they are black.
Also, no, again you are misinterpreting information. There is no way to tell if those black people on TV are Libyan or are from other African nations.
4. If you go to the Middle-East you will see many of the borders (except for Israel) are easy to get through. Plus Jordan and Egypt have been cooperating with the Rebels and support the removal of Assad so it makes sense they would allow the rebels to pass though.
5. Again, i said "probably fear". Sure there are actual soldiers who dislike Assad for things he may have done. You don't know the real reason they left.
6. Scroll up. Watch RAW footage of the rebels and their actions. Disgusting. You are one sick person if you support them.
Let me summaries:
- There are SOME black rebels. - There are SOME Al-Qaeda rebels. - I do not trust your sources. - Some surrounding nations want Assad gone so they allow rebels to go through their country. - I am not in Support of Assad's actions or the Rebels. I am stating the facts i know have been confirmed by multiple people all across the country and from some other sources and they clearly point to the rebels causing all the chaos. If they stopped to negotiate change, all this would be over. They do not want change, they want power.
This post has been edited by GTAknowledge on Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:06
Bringer of Dramageddon Group: The Connection
Joined: Aug 28, 2010
You do realize that you are going on about all of this with a man who is, in all reality, paid to know these kind of things, right? I sh*t you not, it is his real life, money-making job.
Watching you argue with him is like watching someone try to argue nuclear physics with Ernest Rutherford while citing your counterpoints and rebuttals from an episode of Barney. Stop it. You just look silly.
This post has been edited by κενιη on Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 15:27
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 11:53)
I said Syria was peaceful BEFORE the rebels went in. I was there before this happened. It was peaceful. There never was any protests until these rebels got involved. Everything was fine before. Don't be stupid.
I live in Iran, which is comparable to/maybe even worse than Syria. It is peaceful here, although no one is happy with the way we are being treated. You know why it's peaceful? Because people are scared. They will get killed or imprisoned in Evin.
The people you know are either brainwashed, were forced to lie to you or are just blind/stupid.
Also, if you guys communicate by phone, I want to tell you that the government in Iran and probably in Syria listens and records phone calls, especially the one that go outside of the country. So, when I talk to my parents or my relatives in Germany/the US, we never talk about the situation in the country. Because that is a very stupid thing to do.
What I'm telling you, is that you're brainwashed and misinformed.
Wilderness of Mirrors Group: The Connection
Joined: Feb 14, 2011
I've condensed my posts into "moron English" for you as you seem largely incapable of reading anything more than two lines long. And I've not extended my sentences with "meaningless things", like evidence or supporting information, where I can get away with not posting any.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
1. The media get's it's information from most of the sources you a referring to, yes?
Nope, that's not how it works. Almost all research done by news agencies for the purposes of reporting is done in-house. They outsource very little of it to private companies save for risk assessments for their personnel, security provisions and the like. So, in a word, no.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
I don't trust the media and their lies = i am not going to trust the people who supplied them with lies.
Irrelevant- see above. You just "don't trust" sources that don't agree with your point of view- you have absolutely no empirical or measurable reason to do so. Especially as the papers I posted essentially proves that much of what you say is pure and unadulterated manure. Don't see you rebutting those?
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
Stop believing things you have not seen so easily without questioning them.
Stop contradicting far more intelligent and familiar people with many times more experience than you possess. Like many of those articles I posted, for instance.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
So because your sources all say the same thing, you think it is unlikely they are all wrong?
Statistically speaking, yes. But it's in their interest to get it right- because they loose business if they don't- don't you think they're more likely to get it right than not?
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
2. I never suggested all the rebels are part of Al-Qaeda. That's a stupid thing to say and you know it. I said Al-Qaeda is involved in this. That is all. And WHOEVER is assisting the Al-Qaeda rebels is therefore assisting in terrorism.
See, you're making the same mistake again. You're saying "whoever is assisting the al-Qaeda rebels is...assisting terrorism". Your entire argument boils down to a fundamental point that's just plain wrong. You seem to be claiming that it's the rebels, being complicit in assisting al-Qaeda. Quite aside from the fundamental lack of presence of AQ in Libya either then or now, your argument requires all of the political and military decision makers to be associated with AQ. That's obviously not the case. Basically, you'r entire argument is backwards. Members of AQ- not AQ organisationally, but certainly its members- may have assisted the rebels in Libya. Not vice versa.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
What the design of the Al-Qaeda flag got to do with anything? lol. An Al-Qaeda flag, whether 1 year old or 20 years old, remains an Al-Qaeda flag. Stupid argument point.
Quite a lot, actually. Don't you think that if these were paid-up, active members of al-Qaeda, they'd at least possess the correct version of their flag?
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
3. Watch some Arabic TV. Wait for an interview with rebels. Watch in amazement at seeing black people in the background. Also heaps of dead bodies of rebels have been shown and sometimes they are black.
I fail to see the point. You were arguing that these black individuals were specifically Libyans. That's evidently not the case.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
Also, no, again you are misinterpreting information. There is no way to tell if those black people on TV are Libyan or are from other African nations.
How am I misinterpreting information? It's raw statistics, pure and simple. You were the one who claimed that their being black meant that they were Libyans.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
4. If you go to the Middle-East you will see many of the borders (except for Israel) are easy to get through.
We're talking thousands upon thousands of miles. Are you seriously saying that, if this did occur, only one single, shady, Syrian news channel picked up on it?
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
Plus Jordan and Egypt have been cooperating with the Rebels and support the removal of Assad so it makes sense they would allow the rebels to pass though.
To some extent, yes, they've been offering support, but I doubt they're letting heavily armed foreign nations wander their streets or cross vast swathes of their country. It's just absurd.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
5. Again, i said "probably fear". Sure there are actual soldiers who dislike Assad for things he may have done. You don't know the real reason they left.
Well, they've been pretty vocal about the "real reason" they left. Once they'd fled the country, why so vocally speak out against him? Most of the time they fled with their families, so it's not the case of loved ones being at risk. No, they've done it of their own free will and accord, otherwise they wouldn't be so ready to speak up about it. Also, why are so many joining the Free Syrian Army? I mean, it makes no sense to do that out of fear as they're just putting themselves in the same position all over again, except less heavily armed. Remember, casualties amongst citizens and rebels outnumber those in the Syrian military by around 3.5:1, so you're far "safer" in the short term being part of the establishment.
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 14:56)
6. Scroll up. Watch RAW footage of the rebels and their actions. Disgusting. You are one sick person if you support them.
Ohho, so is your raw footage better than mine now too?
There's endless pages more where that came from. That's evidence of war crimes, crimes against humanity and arguably genocide. What do you have to say to defend it now?
This post has been edited by sivispacem on Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 18:05
Again, I must ask. Is this really a civil war? Or a protracted series of massacres against people who can only offer token resistance? I've seen little evidence to justify calling this a 'revolution' or even a war in the traditional sense.
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QUOTE (Greenline @ Thursday, Feb 2 2012, 10:32)
QUOTE (GTAknowledge @ Wednesday, Feb 1 2012, 11:53)
I said Syria was peaceful BEFORE the rebels went in. I was there before this happened. It was peaceful. There never was any protests until these rebels got involved. Everything was fine before. Don't be stupid.
I live in Iran, which is comparable to/maybe even worse than Syria. It is peaceful here, although no one is happy with the way we are being treated. You know why it's peaceful? Because people are scared. They will get killed or imprisoned in Evin.
The people you know are either brainwashed, were forced to lie to you or are just blind/stupid.
Also, if you guys communicate by phone, I want to tell you that the government in Iran and probably in Syria listens and records phone calls, especially the one that go outside of the country. So, when I talk to my parents or my relatives in Germany/the US, we never talk about the situation in the country. Because that is a very stupid thing to do.
What I'm telling you, is that you're brainwashed and misinformed.
This is pretty much it. I've long suspected the people he's been on the phone with either A) are brainwashed, or B) don't exist.
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