[chuckberry04]

@Official General

I have to admit I don't know much about the "gang-history" of the 90s, but to me it looked like that couldn't be representative (even for that time). I know they could virtually control whole neighbourhoods, but that wasn't the case in Los Santos, de facto they controlled the whole city there. The whole city was divided in gang territories. That didn't feel right to me man. Literally every street you turned into there would be a group of gangmembers and mostly they would magically know you are from Groove Street and start shooting at you.

I fail to see the realism of that. I might be terribly wrong, but too me it seemed like a little exagerated. The whole city was ruled by gangs who seemed to be gathering on the street 24/7 like something big was going to happen. How they all recognised me even from a distance, I don't know, maybe they planted a receiver in me.

For the Falling Down part, I think economic frustration and (gang-)provocation is universal; I didn't mean they have to base the whole game on that movie. It's just some idea for I dunno, a mission, or how gangs react. Altough it seems the game will be similar to the movie, given the fact its dealing with the bad economy and $.

[Miamivicecity]

QUOTE (chuckberry04 @ Friday, Jan 27 2012, 01:03)

I fail to see the realism of that. I might be terribly wrong, but too me it seemed like a little exagerated. The whole city was ruled by gangs who seemed to be gathering on the street 24/7 like something big was going to happen. How they all recognised me even from a distance, I don't know, maybe they planted a receiver in me.

I agree with that. One thing I like about GTA IV is gangs don't just open fire at the drop of a hat. It annoys me in SA that I can be driving a car at full speed and somehow they know who I am and start shooting. It did seem exaggerated.

Though in TLAD I think it's a bit stupid how most of the story is centered around a war with the AOD yet you can go right by them outside of the story with patch in plain view and they wont intimidate you. Hell you arm wrestle in their club house. WTF?

All I hope is for the gangs to act like GTA IV. Enough so they notice you unlike TLAD, but not a constant annoyance pretty much like the entire GTA III era.

[ZCABDan]

Groovies, Dominicans, Irish and Italian Mafias. And the san andreas ones can't be ignored. IV era gangs too.

[Official General]

QUOTE (chuckberry04 @ Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 14:03)

@Official General I have to admit I don't know much about the "gang-history" of the 90s, but to me it looked like that couldn't be representative (even for that time). I know they could virtually control whole neighbourhoods, but that wasn't the case in Los Santos, de facto they controlled the whole city there. The whole city was divided in gang territories. That didn't feel right to me man. Literally every street you turned into there would be a group of gangmembers and mostly they would magically know you are from Groove Street and start shooting at you. I fail to see the realism of that. I might be terribly wrong, but too me it seemed like a little exagerated. The whole city was ruled by gangs who seemed to be gathering on the street 24/7 like something big was going to happen. How they all recognised me even from a distance, I don't know, maybe they planted a receiver in me. For the Falling Down part, I think economic frustration and (gang-)provocation is universal; I didn't mean they have to base the whole game on that movie. It's just some idea for I dunno, a mission, or how gangs react. Altough it seems the game will be similar to the movie, given the fact its dealing with the bad economy and $.

@ chuckberry04

I think you are getting confused about what you saw in San Andreas with something else. I do not remember gangs totally ruling the streets like you say they did when I played it, you had to go certain neighbourhoods to see that.

I know where you are confused. In SA, the various coloured-in sections of the map covering much of Los Santos that showed which territory the street gangs controlled, was actually just an indicator of the size/extent of their presence in that particular location of the city. It did not always mean that a street gang controlled that part of the city, it just meant that their presence was much more stronger there than compared to other rival gangs. For instance, Ganton in SA's Los Santos was clearly a gang neighbourhood, it was Grove Street Family territory and they totally controlled it - go there and you will always see Grove Street gang members teeming in the streets. However CJ could go across the other side of the city to lead his gang to fight against a rival Balla gang set that hang out in Verona Beach as their turf. Verona Beach is normal neighbourhood, you will not always see gang members there, just every now and then. Once CJ defeats them in gang war, Verona Beach will then become the territory of the Grove Street Families, however they don't control it, as it is not really a gang neighbourhood or ghetto. It just means that Grove Street are the dominant street gang that can be seen in Verona Beach and not the Ballas anymore.

As for the gangs gathering in the street part, that was very realistic, it does really happen like that in LA. Why not watch LA street gang documentaries and you will see for yourself that Rockstar pretty much got the gang thing SA very right and accurate. You can go to entire neighbourhoods in LA and you would definitely and instantly see the streets teeming with gang members. It really is like that man, believe it is.

@ Miamivicecity

The gangs shooting at you in SA was very realistic, because that what happens in real-life LA gang culture, especially with Bloods (red) and Crips (blue). In LA, if you are a Crip gang member walking around in a Blood neighbourhood wearing all-blue clothing, it is very likely Blood gang members would shoot at you on sight, and this was especially very true in the 1990s when the Bloods vs Crips rivalry was at its peak and most intense. The reason why you did not see that stuff in GTA IV is because it is based on New York, and New York street gang culture is not like the kind seen in LA. In New York, street gangs are less conspicuous because of much stricter New York law enforcement pressure, and they are a lot more careful about how they go about their criminal activities especially if its to do with guns and shootings. NYC street gangs are heavily armed and very violent too (especially in Brooklyn), but they can be more described as 'hustlers' rather than gangbangers. Thats why Rockstar made it that way in GTA IV. LA is different, street gangs have much more power and the police are not as efficient as in NYC, so the LA street gangs tend to be more brazen and open with shootings and other acts of violence.

This post has been edited by Official General on Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 16:03

[DarrinPA]

Rockstar made GTA SA for a reason, the gangs were unimaginable. Very few times in history can somebody say that a group of people besides the government ran the streets, this was one of the few. Some may say it parallels the 1920's in which Chicago was run by the mob, lead by Al Capone. But that was different, a few hundred leaders who had large amounts of power and wealth. Where as the Los Angeles gangs had a large number of members all fighting for power and wealth. The 1920's simply fought over the illegal trade of liquor. The 1990's crack epidemic took it to a new level. The users were hooked after their first experience, nothing stopped them from getting their next hit. Violence, prostitution, robbery, or even murder were all an option to score their next crack rock. The Po li ce wanted a piece of this action. The reward was worth the risk, the ablilty to cover up their own crimes was too easy. When Cops, Dealers, and Addicts all have the same interest and goals you have a dangerous situation. After almost 20 years of L.A.P.D. corruption the Federal Government finally ended it's official oversight in 2009.

If you have the time, watch all 4 parts of Peter Jenning's Documentary of South Central if you don't believe that gangs AND the police are still a problem in LA. It took place 10 years after GTA SA's gang setting.

[canttakemyid]

I look forward to Cartels given they are the only criminal force that would be realistically challenging to go up against.

[senor_huevos_benedicto]

It'll be very interesting to see whether the same gangs will be used and what spins will be put upon them.

If they do bring back the gang names (which I think to be highly unlikely) I think the Vagos will be the strongest gang after getting involved in the ever growing Mexican Drug Cartel business.

[Trideez]

QUOTE (Miamivicecity @ Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 08:22)

What makes people think GSF, The Ballas etc will be in GTA V? Does it need to be said GTA V isn't a sequel to SA? Besides I don't want to play a game with the exact same gangs as a game that came out nearly 8 years ago. How boring and un creative. R* didn't bring back The Leones, Yardies, Diablos etc in GTA IV. Now I'm no expert on LA gang culture, but the gangs R* based their own on in SA probably still exist today with new gangs I  guess, but they'll certainly go under different names. Besides given the theme of the game I doubt we'll be as exposed to the street gang culture as much as SA. Infact it'll probably serve as a back drop and wont be as significant to the story as SA, but they need some role regardless. Just like the Italian mafia in GTA IV.

No disrespect to you, but you are dead wrong. You admit you don't know much about LA gang culture and the truth is you know even less than the little you think you know. First off, the gangs in LA don't change names like they change their pants. The Rollin 60 Crips have been the Rollin 60 Crips since the 1970's! So have most of the others, these gangs have THOUSANDS of members, in ONE gang! There are gangs in LA with 20,000+ members, you think a gang like that disappears in a few years? It doesn't. The BALLAS and the FAMILIES were Rockstars version of the CRIPS and BLOODS, and the Crips and Bloods are as much a part of Los Ageles today as they were in the 90's. And since the game is based in Rockstars version of Los Angeles, it's only common sense that the game will include Rockstars version of the Bloods and Crips, aka Families and Ballas. It simply would not be LA (or LS) without them. Period.

*I do agree with you though that they will probably not play a HUGE role in the main storyline in GTA V, but their presence will be known and you will see their graffiti and see them wearing their colors and what not. And I'm really hoping that there is a DLC game that focuses on them in the future.

[Trideez]

QUOTE (Static94 @ Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 01:01)

South Central Los Angeles Ghetto life modern day, btw it looks like Grove street Gangs in L.A are still active ass f*ck, but not depicting in the media like before http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkkC9cK8Hz0&ob=av2e

LOL How you gonna post a Waka Flacka video to depict modern ghetto life in LA. Yeah he's shooting the video in "the Jungle", but I can pretty much guarantee you that that was his FIRST and LAST time ever being there and you can bet your ass that he payed probably 10,000+ dollars to the OG's in charge there for his safe passage. If you really want to understand LA gang culture, www.streetgangs.com would be a good resource, not Waka Flaka lol.

[Miamivicecity]

QUOTE (Trideez @ Sunday, Jan 29 2012, 10:50)

No disrespect to you, but you are dead wrong.  You admit you don't know much about LA gang culture and the truth is you know even less than the little you think you know.  First off, the gangs in LA don't change names like they change their pants.  The Rollin 60 Crips have been the Rollin 60 Crips since the 1970's!  So have most of the others, these gangs have THOUSANDS of members, in ONE gang!  There are gangs in LA with 20,000+ members, you think a gang like that disappears in a few years?  It doesn't.  The BALLAS and the FAMILIES were Rockstars version of the CRIPS and BLOODS, and the Crips and Bloods are as much a part of Los Ageles today as they were in the 90's.  And since the game is based in Rockstars version of Los Angeles, it's only common sense that the game will include Rockstars version of the Bloods and Crips, aka Families and Ballas.  It simply would not be LA (or LS) without them.  Period. *I do agree with you though that they will probably not play a HUGE role in the main storyline in GTA V, but their presence will be known and you will see their graffiti and see them wearing their colors and what not.  And I'm really hoping that there is a DLC game that focuses on them in the future.

I'm not saying R*'s version of the Bloods and Crips wont be in the game. All I'm saying is they're most likely going to be called something else and without starting the whole era/universe argument GTAV is looking to be a largely clean slate like GTA IV was to GTA III.

It would be different if this game was a sequel to SA, but it's not. I don't know why people expect to see "The Ballas" and "GSF" in their originality in GTA V. That goes for all the other gangs too.

I'm not doubting R* will base their own versions on the Bloods, Crips and whoever again, but I'm 99.9% confident they will have NO connection to the ones in SA other than being loosely based on their real life counterparts. I just thought it would be common sense after GTA IV basically carried nothing over from GTA III.

I hope that clears up what I was trying to say.

This post has been edited by Miamivicecity on Sunday, Jan 29 2012, 00:24

[The Made Man]

If GTA V is in the same universe as GTA IV, then I expect the Biker gang Angels of Death to return. Since they are from California and SA us based off Cali.

[Trideez]

QUOTE (Miamivicecity @ Saturday, Jan 28 2012, 19:08)

QUOTE (Trideez @ Sunday, Jan 29 2012, 10:50) No disrespect to you, but you are dead wrong.  You admit you don't know much about LA gang culture and the truth is you know even less than the little you think you know.  First off, the gangs in LA don't change names like they change their pants.  The Rollin 60 Crips have been the Rollin 60 Crips since the 1970's!  So have most of the others, these gangs have THOUSANDS of members, in ONE gang!  There are gangs in LA with 20,000+ members, you think a gang like that disappears in a few years?  It doesn't.  The BALLAS and the FAMILIES were Rockstars version of the CRIPS and BLOODS, and the Crips and Bloods are as much a part of Los Ageles today as they were in the 90's.  And since the game is based in Rockstars version of Los Angeles, it's only common sense that the game will include Rockstars version of the Bloods and Crips, aka Families and Ballas.  It simply would not be LA (or LS) without them.  Period. *I do agree with you though that they will probably not play a HUGE role in the main storyline in GTA V, but their presence will be known and you will see their graffiti and see them wearing their colors and what not.  And I'm really hoping that there is a DLC game that focuses on them in the future. I'm not saying R*'s version of the Bloods and Crips wont be in the game. All I'm saying is they're most likely going to be called something else and without starting the whole era/universe argument GTAV is looking to be a largely clean slate like GTA IV was to GTA III. It would be different if this game was a sequel to SA, but it's not. I don't know why people expect to see "The Ballas" and "GSF" in their originality in GTA V. That goes for all the other gangs too. I'm not doubting R* will base their own versions on the Bloods, Crips and whoever again, but I'm 99.9% confident they will have NO connection to the ones in SA other than being loosely based on their real life counterparts. I just thought it would be common sense after GTA IV basically carried nothing over from GTA III. I hope that clears up what I was trying to say.

I don't understand why you would think they'd change the name of the Ballas and Families though. Those are the names that they have established for the ICONIC gangs of LA, the Bloods and Crips. Sure, I don't think we're going to see Sweet rolling around, but the GSF, had THOUSANDS of members. Why did all 10,000 of them change their names? They didn't. We're not talking about some rinky dink little town gang called the Rattlesnakes. Gangs like that come and go, the Bloods and Crips have been at it since the 70's, that's 40 years. There's no end to them in sight. And Rockstar already established them in their Universe as the Families and Ballas.

[Miamivicecity]

QUOTE (Trideez @ Sunday, Jan 29 2012, 11:30)

I don't understand why you would think they'd change the name of the Ballas and Families though.  Those are the names that they have established for the ICONIC gangs of LA, the Bloods and Crips.  Sure, I don't think we're going to see Sweet rolling around, but the GSF, had THOUSANDS of members.  Why did all 10,000 of them change their names?  They didn't.  We're not talking about some rinky dink little town gang called the Rattlesnakes.  Gangs like that come and go, the Bloods and Crips have been at it since the 70's, that's 40 years.  There's no end to them in sight.  And Rockstar already established them in their Universe as the Families and Ballas.

The reason I think the names will be different is for the reason I said above. The game isn't going to be a sequel to SA.

Besides if they were called The Ballas and GSF we'd have idiots claiming that they saw CJ, Sweet, Big Smoke's corpse still decomposing in some shallow grave etc.

Not only that, but I would rather R* be creative instead of recycling from an almost 8 year old game, but that's my opinion. Basing off the fact NO gang from GTA III was in GTA IV I'm only lead to believe this will be the case in GTA V.

R* may very well look for inspiration again, but they're not obligated to call them by the same name because they were already established in SA.

[ubergoon1912]

i saw the leones and the diablos & Uptown Yardies & Colombian Cartel & Yakuza & Liberty City Triads & Southside Hoods & Forelli Family & Sindacco Family & Sicilian Mob in gta 3 and lcs why weren't they in gta iv?

my point being it takes place in MULTIPLE universes or eras rockstar established the bloods and crips as grove st and ballas in the 3d or gta 3 era so they will have diffrent names and people maybe they'll be called the woundz and the bonez or something like that

[Scottendo]

QUOTE (Official General @ Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 07:31)

There is no way Rockstar are gonna allow you to play as character from a previous GTA game in a new one.

Toni Cipriani
Vic Vance


At any rate the guy who is narrating the trailer doesn't sound Irish, but know knows? The leaked casting call showed a McReary as one of the characters, so it's obvious we are going to have some association with them.

But that begs the question just how much?

[ubergoon1912]

QUOTE (Scottendo @ Saturday, Jan 28 2012, 19:55)

QUOTE (Official General @ Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 07:31) There is no way Rockstar are gonna allow you to play as character from a previous GTA game in a new one. Toni Cipriani Vic Vance At any rate the guy who is narrating the trailer doesn't sound Irish, but know knows? The leaked casting call showed a McReary as one of the characters, so it's obvious we are going to have some association with them. But that begs the question just how much?

yea but there in the exact same place just a few yrs before what he means is that there not going to have the exact same character from a previous gta in an entirely diffrent time and place rockstar doesn't do that with gta and before you say claude they only said that his name MAY be speed to get people to stop asking if there the same character but there can be a McReary relitive but i highly doubt you'll be playing as Packie you'll maybe see him though i hope so

This post has been edited by ubergoon1912 on Sunday, Jan 29 2012, 01:05

[Scottendo]

QUOTE (ubergoon1912 @ Saturday, Jan 28 2012, 19:03)

yea but there in the exact same place just a few yrs before what he means is that there not going to have the exact same character from a previous gta in an entirely diffrent time and place rockstar doesn't do that with gta and before you say claude they only said that his name MAY be speed to get people to stop asking if there the same character

I understand that, but what does that matter? Can't Rockstar do something new for a change? Before San Andreas people said the exact same thing (trust me I was there), and then we got to play as Toni. And the leaked casting call, and the credits sequence of The Ballad of Gay Tony showing Packie leaving on a plane heading west proves that we're going to at least see them in the game somewhere!

As a playable character or not, like I said I don't know and I don't care either way, I'm just excited for any new information.

[The Made Man]

If gangs have the same names as Ballas or Grove Street, then that would be dumb. Since GTA SA is not in the same universe as GTA V. I would prefer a different name.

[StockLoc]

QUOTE (Zip87 @ Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 12:59)

QUOTE (glenn tha killer @ Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 07:49) QUOTE (StockLoc @ Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 04:40) Since Packie Mcreary left LC for Los Santos, I'm sure there will be Irish gangs in the game. If you don't know, during the ending credits of 'The Ballad of Gay Tony', you see Packie leaving LC heading South-West; the location of Los Santos. A leaked picture on youtube showed a factory called "Mcreary Industries" exists in the industrial area of Los Santos. Thats a very good point, there may be an Irish gang after all. That's one thing I believe too. I said in an older thread how the trailer voice sounds alike to the accents of the McReary's. Also, the McReary crime family has recently lost their influence in Liberty City underworld and is falling apart. Now, from the "You know how it is" line it's likely that at one point the MC got out of the underworld game. It's common knowledge that a crime family member can't just give up the life, but with the McReary fam falling apart, it could happen. Would add up with Packie, visiting an old associate in LS, forcing him back into crime and the rumor of one character from the older games making a return in V. One more thing, as R* has taken influence from Sons of Anarchy to make Lost & Damned, I wouldn't be surprised if they'd take the whole irish american thing to V, since the Socal countryside is where SOA takes place too.

Hopefully we're right then, eh?

It'd be very interesting playing as an associate to the McRearies, but I'm kind of tired of the whole 'mafia' aspect of GTA IV. It made the game very dark and very boring. It wouldn't suit the setting of a sub-tropical climate.

I still prefer the 'black' gangs over the 'Italian' gangs as they have a wider range of personality.

[Sanjeem]

QUOTE (StockLoc @ Sunday, Jan 29 2012, 01:19)

QUOTE (Zip87 @ Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 12:59) QUOTE (glenn tha killer @ Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 07:49) QUOTE (StockLoc @ Thursday, Jan 26 2012, 04:40) Since Packie Mcreary left LC for Los Santos, I'm sure there will be Irish gangs in the game. If you don't know, during the ending credits of 'The Ballad of Gay Tony', you see Packie leaving LC heading South-West; the location of Los Santos. A leaked picture on youtube showed a factory called "Mcreary Industries" exists in the industrial area of Los Santos. Thats a very good point, there may be an Irish gang after all. That's one thing I believe too. I said in an older thread how the trailer voice sounds alike to the accents of the McReary's. Also, the McReary crime family has recently lost their influence in Liberty City underworld and is falling apart. Now, from the "You know how it is" line it's likely that at one point the MC got out of the underworld game. It's common knowledge that a crime family member can't just give up the life, but with the McReary fam falling apart, it could happen. Would add up with Packie, visiting an old associate in LS, forcing him back into crime and the rumor of one character from the older games making a return in V. One more thing, as R* has taken influence from Sons of Anarchy to make Lost & Damned, I wouldn't be surprised if they'd take the whole irish american thing to V, since the Socal countryside is where SOA takes place too. Hopefully we're right then, eh? It'd be very interesting playing as an associate to the McRearies, but I'm kind of tired of the whole 'mafia' aspect of GTA IV. It made the game very dark and very boring. It wouldn't suit the setting of a sub-tropical climate. I still prefer the 'black' gangs over the 'Italian' gangs as they have a wider range of personality.

A wider range of personality? Although I agree that IV was dark and gloomy to me at least it wasn't the fact that the Mafia was in it, it was because the story in general was dark. Mafia figures in GTA have been seen to be some of the most colorful of characters, even in real life mob figures always seem to come across as colorful. It's not the gang I think that makes a GTA game gloomy it is the setting and story, hence why V already looks like it's going to be a more upsetting kind of game than IV.