[Steve Crook]

In mission Guardian Angels you have to go to the car park and pick up the Kruger, and then Lance arrives and you go and protect Diaz.

The trouble is that if you've been to the West island early, as I usually do, then you've probably picked up an M4 and loads of ammo for it. So when you pick up the Kruger, you lose that M4 and have to make do with the Kruger.

Is there any way to avoid picking up the Kruger?
I'm thinking that there might be a way like in GTA SA when you do mission Interdiction for Mike Toreno. That wants you to pick up a regular rocket launcher. But if you've already got the heat seeking rockets then you can just stand in the marker to pick up the regular rocket launcher, and not actually pick it up

Steve

[Brokencyde]

You could get the Kruger, go to the second island and come back I suppose. Wouldn't be to hard.

[punknoodle]

Dont know if theres any way around it...I always stock up on the Kruger by the house up by Northpoint Mall anyway and wait until I've taken over Diaz's mansion before I go to the M4.

It always peeves me to lose my minigun ammo
(I do hidden packages first) to the M60 when you do the helicopter mission with Lance Vance Dance.

[Spuds725]

I don't think you can avoid it without modding the game--- I know next to nothing about modding but if you are playing the PC version, it would probably be an easy mod.

Does the ammo carryover between the weapons-- I don't recall for that one.

[Steve Crook]

QUOTE (Spuds725 @ Dec 4 2008, 03:17)

Does the ammo carryover between the weapons-- I don't recall for that one.

Yes, it does. So that's something. At least it does for the M4 and Kruger.

When you have to get the M60 on the helicopter mission with Lance (Phnom Penh '86) you lose all of your minigun ammo

Steve

[Craig]

Makes me wonder if there's a list of missions that cause you to change your weapon, especially noting those that carry different type of ammo, thus causing you to lose everything you had stock piled. Obviously one of the most devastating is that in Phnom Penh '86 as Steve said, though there must be a list somewhere. Not just for Vice City either, I reckon this applies to every 3D game in the series.

[Steve Crook]

Some missions force you to pick up a certain weapon. If you had a different weapon in the same slot then you'd normally lose that other weapon, and you'll often also lose any ammo you had collected for it. This is especially a problem later in the game when you've collected a lot of ammo for your favourite weapons and it's also a problem if you've been to the west island early and got weapons that you aren't expected to have at this point.

For these comments I'm assuming that I've been to the west island early and that I've got all the hidden packages so I'm well stocked up with my favourite weapons, the katana, the Colt Python pistol, the MP5 sub-machine gun, the S.P.A.S. 12 shotgun, the M4 assault rifle, the .308 sniper rifle and the minigun with lots of ammo for each of them.

You can "save" a weapon at the airport by going into the terminal and so leaving all your weapons outside. Then come back out and pick up all the weapons you want except for the one(s) you want to save. Go and do the mission then come back to the airport where you can pick up your original weapon again, complete with all the ammunition you had for it.

You can do a similar thing at the golf course at the Country Club except that this doesn't save the sniper rifle, whichever one you had. You just lose the sniper rifle if you go into the Country Club.

Back Alley Brawl makes you pick up the pistol that Lance gives you, losing the Colt Python (and ammo) if you had it

Jury Fury suggests you pick up the hammer to smash the jurors' cars. But you don't have to pick it up, you can just shoot up the jurors' cars or crash into them

Treacherous Swine makes you pick up the chain saw that the Colonel gives you and so lose the Katana of any other melee weapon you have. You don't have to use it though, you can use any other weapon you have to hand. You can't run very fast with the chain saw, although it is an impressive way to do the job
You can pick up another Katana in the Tarbush Cafe, in North point mall

Guardian Angels makes you pick up a Kruger, losing the M4 if you've been to the west island early. But you can carry over the ammo you had for the M4 and when you change back to an M4 you can still keep the ammo.

Phnom Penh '86 makes you pick up an M60 so you lose the minigun and all the ammo you had for it.
This is a tricky one. You can save the minigun at the golf club, but that means you lose the .308 sniper rifle because that can't be saved at the golf club. Or you can save the minigun at the airport but that involves a few additional trips to the west island before you're supposed to be able to get there.
As the west island is unlocked after this mission, this is the only one I haven't tried. I can easily tour the safe houses and stock up on minigun ammo.

Supply & Demand makes you lose whatever you've got in your assault rifles slot. The Kruger or the M4. You lose the gun and all your ammo. This is an odd one as the gun you're firing on the boat seems to be an M60 in the Heavy artillery slot.
You can save your assault rifle at the airport.

Dirty Lickin's makes you pick up the standard sniper rifle, losing your .308 sniper rifle.
You can save your .308 sniper rifle at the airport.

Check out at the Check-In also makes you pick up a standard sniper rifle and even if you fire all the rounds so that it doesn't seem to be in your armoury - when you go outside the airport you can't get the .308 sniper rifle that you left there - it's changed to a standard sniper rifle with only a few rounds in it
Don't pick up any other weapons in the airport, like the bodyguard's Uzi or a pisol from a P.I.G., when you get back outside the weapon in that slot will have changed to the weapon you picked up - often without any ammo

Gun Runner makes you pick up an M60, losing your minigun and whatever ammo you've collected for it. It also makes you pick up a .357 pistol (Colt Python) and a S.P.A.S. 12 shotgun but I was already carrying those. It also makes you pick up an Ingram Mac-10 submachine gun, but when you change to another submachine gun you don't lose your ammo so you can easily change back again.
You can save the minigun at the airport.

Steve

This post has been edited by Steve Crook on Tuesday, Dec 9 2008, 14:32

[Craig]

For Jury Fury, what other melee weapons do you have access to prior to that point? If it's the case you have a baseball bat for example, you may not need to pick up the hammer. If I recall correctly the hammer belongs to a poor pedestrian who is knocked down in front of you.

[radioman]

QUOTE (Masterkraft @ Dec 4 2008, 07:04)

For Jury Fury, what other melee weapons do you have access to prior to that point? If it's the case you have a baseball bat for example, you may not need to pick up the hammer. If I recall correctly the hammer belongs to a poor pedestrian who is knocked down in front of you.

If you do the Hidden Packages early on, you can have the Chain Saw-that spawns at the hotel. But I also hate the missions where you are forced to pick-up the lesser quality weapons, thus repalceing your high powered ones.-I guess Rockstar didn't want you to get a high ammo count for the good weapons early on. Just like they did in GTA 3 where you lost all your weapons before the final story mission. and just like in VCS, where you lost all your weapons and had to start over after the 3rd story mission. There are some as mentioned, where your ammo carries over, but then there are others where you lose A LOT of ammo when you have to replace, as mentioned as well.

Steve Crook, I think you covered the missions that require a transfer of weapons very well. Good Job.

[Steve Crook]

QUOTE (Masterkraft @ Dec 4 2008, 12:04)

For Jury Fury, what other melee weapons do you have access to prior to that point? If it's the case you have a baseball bat for example, you may not need to pick up the hammer. If I recall correctly the hammer belongs to a poor pedestrian who is knocked down in front of you.

As I've visited the west island early I have the Katana which I would prefer to keep as a melee weapon. You could have also picked up the machetes that the other chefs drop from Back Alley Brawl

As for Jury Fury, you can just shoot them up - the cars, not the jurors

The northern one is easy enough. The juror doesn't come out until you've damaged his car enough. Until it's at least at the black smoke stage.

The southern one is trickier as he's standing near the car. When I started firing at the car he got in it and went to drive away - but he hit a passing truck and just stopped by me. I think that was deliberate because a couple of hammers fell out of the truck and the prompt told me to use them to hit the car until he got out. But a few more shots soon got him out

Steve

[radioman]

QUOTE

The southern one is trickier as he's standing near the car. When I started firing at the car he got in it and went to drive away - but he hit a passing truck and just stopped by me. I think that was deliberate because a couple of hammers fell out of the truck and the prompt told me to use them to hit the car until he got out. But a few more shots soon got him out

Yeah, that one is scripted that way, because any time you hit/shoot the car or hit the juror, he will always get in the car and drive-off, but will always hit the truck in the process and stop for you to hit/damage his car.

I forgot about the Katana being in VC, that is a great melee weapon to have and one I always try to keep in inventory at all times.

[Craig]

Does ramming the juror's cars with your own count? Or are you forced to use weapons?

And something radioman just said reminded me of the many times in San Andreas were you lose every weapon you own. One of the most memorable to me is the one where you and Wuzi's men take to the skies and attempt to take out a neighbouring ship full of Da Nang Boys (the name escapes me now, sorry). After much pummeling you land in the water as part of the mission and CJ claims to have lost every weapon but"his blade" - interesting if you don't have a knife in your slot.

But yeah, back on topic, I'm just wondering how many loopholes there are when it comes to these missions that seemingly force you to change weapons. There must be a fair few ways out of them.

[flicko]

QUOTE (Masterkraft @ Dec 4 2008, 12:37)

Does ramming the juror's cars with your own count? Or are you forced to use weapons?

Yeah it does, and I believe it's considerably easier and quicker to complete the mission using only the vehicle you're in.

I'll have a run through VC later to see if I can find any more loopholes in the game, when being seemingly forced to switch weapons.

[Flesh-n-Bone]

QUOTE (radioman @ Dec 4 2008, 14:29)

If you do the Hidden Packages early on, you can have the Chain Saw-that spawns at the hotel. But I also hate the missions where you are forced to pick-up the lesser quality weapons, thus repalceing your high powered ones.-I guess Rockstar didn't want you to get a high ammo count for the good weapons early on. Just like they did in GTA 3 where you lost all your weapons before the final story mission. and just like in VCS, where you lost all your weapons and had to start over after the 3rd story mission. There are some as mentioned, where your ammo carries over, but then there are others where you lose A LOT of ammo when you have to replace, as mentioned as well.

Yep. In VCS when you do "Conduct Unbecoming" you lose your weapons, same thing is supposedly happening on "Burning Bridges" however if you look to your right your weapons are there. In GTA3 during the last mission you sadly lose everything making the mission way harder. In SA, you lose everything after The Green Sabre as well.

[Steve Crook]

QUOTE (Flesh-n-Bone @ Dec 4 2008, 22:43)

In GTA3 during the last mission you sadly lose everything making the mission way harder. In SA, you lose everything after The Green Sabre as well.

In GTA SA you also lose all weapons, except your blade, during mission The Da Nang Thang.

In Dam and Blast, if you don't parachute onto the marker then you'll lose all your weapons. Even if you land on the dam quay, if you don't land in the marker then you'll lose them all. I'm told that there is a glitch to get around this but I always land in the marker

With both of those, you can always go to the nearest Ammunation or tour around various weapons pick-up points and re-arm yourself before completing the mission.

Steve

[flicko]

QUOTE (radioman @ Dec 4 2008, 12:29)

Steve Crook, I think you covered the missions that require a transfer of weapons very well. Good Job.

I believe he listed all but one. In the mission 'Rub out', where you assassinate Diaz, Lance pulls up in a Stinger, opens up the boot to reveal a couple of AK-47s, which he gives to you prior to the mission. Other than that, I think you listed them all Steve.

There is no way to avoid using the listed weapons, as they are scripted in the game, as Radioman has pointed out. But for Jury fury, you definitely do not need to acquire a weapon to complete the mission. You can complete the whole mission whilst remaining inside your vehicle.

QUOTE (Steve Crook)

As I've visited the west island early I have the Katana which I would prefer to keep as a melee weapon. You could have also picked up the machetes that the other chefs drop from Back Alley Brawl

Don't forget you can pick up the Katana sword inside Tarbush Cafe, in North point mall as well as the second island.

QUOTE (Steve Crook)

The southern one is trickier as he's standing near the car. When I started firing at the car he got in it and went to drive away - but he hit a passing truck and just stopped by me. I think that was deliberate because a couple of hammers fell out of the truck and the prompt told me to use them to hit the car until he got out. But a few more shots soon got him out

Yeah, that is deliberate. In Fact, the only way to successfully destroy his car is to make him get in his car and attempt to drive off. An easier way of getting him to enter his vehicle is to slowly approach him, and then run over the woman he is stood with. This will frighten him and force him to flee to his vehicle, triggering the Spand Express truck to bash into him. I believe the woman is an unintentional guide to help you complete the mission.

Also, if you continuously smash his car with your own car, and force him to get out and concede defeat, no matter which way you were facing, your car will now be facing the direction where the other jurors car is located. This is why I go to the southern jurors location first, as it is a tad bit quicker.

Steve, if you want to keep all of your ammunition when going into Guardian angels, why don't you make a stop at leaf links gold course, go through the gates and past the security, which will leave your weapons at the entrance, and then go and complete the mission. When you complete the mission go back to Leaf Links golf course and retrieve your ammunition.

I haven't verified this, so I'm not 100% sure it will work, but it's worth a shot.

[Steve Crook]

QUOTE (flicko @ Dec 5 2008, 13:41)

Steve, if you want to keep all of your ammunition when going into Guardian angels, why don't you make a stop at leaf links gold course, go through the gates and past the security, which will leave your weapons at the entrance, and then go and complete the mission. When you complete the mission go back to Leaf Links golf course and retrieve your ammunition. I haven't verified this, so I'm not 100% sure it will work, but it's worth a shot.

All good points. Thanks especially for the note about Rub Out. I haven't got to that in my current run through the game where I'm checking which changes are forced on you.

That trick about leaving the weapons at the golf club is certainly worth trying. It could also be worth trying that for the ones like Check out at the Check-In where you lose your .308 sniper rifle with all of its ammo

Steve

Update: It looks like Tommy picks up a Kruger (AK-47) from the trunk of Lance's car. But if you had the M4 when you start mission Rub Out then you still have the M4 during it


This post has been edited by Steve Crook on Friday, Dec 5 2008, 14:29

[Flesh-n-Bone]

QUOTE (flicko @ Dec 5 2008, 15:41)

QUOTE (radioman @ Dec 4 2008, 12:29) Steve Crook, I think you covered the missions that require a transfer of weapons very well. Good Job. I believe he listed all but one. In the mission 'Rub out', where you assassinate Diaz, Lance pulls up in a Stinger, opens up the boot to reveal a couple of AK-47s, which he gives to you prior to the mission. Other than that, I think you listed them all Steve.

Small correction, there's no AK in VC, he arrives with M4's and the car he drives is a Stallion. (not that it matters!)

[Steve Crook]

QUOTE (Flesh-n-Bone @ Dec 5 2008, 14:10)

Small correction, there's no AK in VC, he arrives with M4's and the car he drives is a Stallion. (not that it matters!)

Lance certainly picks up an M4, but the weapon that Tommy picks up looks like a cross between the two. It has the curved magazine of an AK-47 / Kruger but it has the body of an M4

But see my additional comment above. It's an M4 that Tommy finishes up with

Steve

[flicko]

QUOTE (Flesh-n-Bone @ Dec 5 2008, 14:10)

QUOTE (flicko @ Dec 5 2008, 15:41) QUOTE (radioman @ Dec 4 2008, 12:29) Steve Crook, I think you covered the missions that require a transfer of weapons very well. Good Job. I believe he listed all but one. In the mission 'Rub out', where you assassinate Diaz, Lance pulls up in a Stinger, opens up the boot to reveal a couple of AK-47s, which he gives to you prior to the mission. Other than that, I think you listed them all Steve. Small correction, there's no AK in VC, he arrives with M4's and the car he drives is a Stallion. (not that it matters!)

Ah, sorry about that. I did mean Stallion, I can assure you!

QUOTE (Steve Crook)

That trick about leaving the weapons at the golf club is certainly worth trying. It could also be worth trying that for the ones like Check out at the Check-In where you lose your .308 sniper rifle with all of its ammo

And that's another thing to note, as soon as you enter the Airport terminal through the gates, your current lot of ammo does not go through the gate with you, instead it remains outside. So, when doing missions like Check out at the check in, after you complete the missions, just go back to the entrance to the airport and pick up your weapons again.

I can verify this, because I have since done the same thing in the past.

So that's Leaf Links and the Airport terminal you can use to keep your preferred ammunition, when mission scripts seemingly force you to have other weapons.