[ADJ]

Personally, I find it really pathetic that someone can use homosexuality as an insult. It's just the same as racism or sexism but for some reason is taken less seriously.

All of these are not the fault of the victim of such actions and there is no justification for their discrimination.

Opinons...?

[Mr. Wongs]

Uh, yes, thanks for the insight. It would've been more enligthening if it was perhaps... original?

Stuff like this will always be part of society, as long as humans continue to live together in large groups. People will always be different, and others will always oppose those differences. No matter how much we preach this stuff, ignorance reigns supreme.

[jizzyman]

So basically Wongs your philosophy is to ignore it, not attempt to change it, because it will always be there. Intriguing but not of equal interest to most people.

QUOTE

Stuff like this will always be part of society, as long as humans continue to live together in large groups. People will always be different, and others will always oppose those differences. No matter how much we preach this stuff, ignorance reigns supreme.

So yeah lets just quit right? Let people be ignorant, sexist, racist, and not enlighten them. After all

its always been there anyways right?

[Mr. Wongs]

Way to misinterpret my post. Read carefully before stamping on your assumptions. Nowhere in my post did I suggest we ignore the problems of ignorance, stupidity, racism etc. that exist in society. On the contrary, we should strive to minimize these ugly spots as much as possible. One thing must be realized though: such vices can never truly be eliminated, only weakened. You have to recognize the non-ideal nature of this world. Not all people are compatible with all others. As long as humans are born as diverse and variant beings, differences will always exist.

Anyways, my intent was not to ramble on about the differences of human beings. In the end, we're all part of the same specie. If all people actually let that sink into their thick heads, maybe we wouldn't have things like homophobia and discrimination. But hey, it's an imperfect world.

[just another thug]

Society is to blame for most of this. Homophobia and such are just characteristics of a thick-headed follow the crowd type of society. Until society as a whole deems is acceptable to have homosexuals amoung us, the average person will not accept homosexuals.

[Mortukai]

Oh no! Not society! That tyrannical monolithic invisible force that is a life unto itself akin to Satan incarnate! Let's blame society for all the ills of this world! That way we can sit back and wait for someone else to do something about it. After all, it's society's fault, not ours, and we aren't responsible for society.

Society is made up of people. People dictate society. Society is what the aggregate of individuals make it, and what the individuals imagine it to be.

So how about we take responsibility for ourselves and make it our duty to educate others and spread understanding, compassion, and ideals of equality among all those we interact with? If enough of us do that, maybe "society" will change, by virtue of changes in the people that comprise it.

[Bigs]

Yeah, "dumbass fag" seems to be one of the more popular insults where I live. Even when it's obvious someone is not homosexual, they seem to say "fag" instead of "dumbass" or "f*cknugget" which really doesn't make sense to me.

[AllDoItTheSame]

well said morty

[just another thug]

QUOTE (Mortukai @ Apr 19 2005, 12:04)

Oh no! Not society! That tyrannical monolithic invisible force that is a life unto itself akin to Satan incarnate! Let's blame society for all the ills of this world! That way we can sit back and wait for someone else to do something about it. After all, it's society's fault, not ours, and we aren't responsible for society. Society is made up of people. People dictate society. Society is what the aggregate of individuals make it, and what the individuals imagine it to be. So how about we take responsibility for ourselves and make it our duty to educate others and spread understanding, compassion, and ideals of equality among all those we interact with? If enough of us do that, maybe "society" will change, by virtue of changes in the people that comprise it.

Well there are already people outhere spreading their views and ideals and educating others. Is society changed, no. So your plan hasn't worked yet.

[ctel]

QUOTE (just another thug @ Apr 19 2005, 20:04)

QUOTE (Mortukai @ Apr 19 2005, 12:04) Oh no! Not society! That tyrannical monolithic invisible force that is a life unto itself akin to Satan incarnate! Let's blame society for all the ills of this world! That way we can sit back and wait for someone else to do something about it. After all, it's society's fault, not ours, and we aren't responsible for society. Society is made up of people. People dictate society. Society is what the aggregate of individuals make it, and what the individuals imagine it to be. So how about we take responsibility for ourselves and make it our duty to educate others and spread understanding, compassion, and ideals of equality among all those we interact with? If enough of us do that, maybe "society" will change, by virtue of changes in the people that comprise it. Well there are already people outhere spreading their views and ideals and educating others. Is society changed, no. So your plan hasn't worked yet.

I see alot of change in society, all the time.
How can you not see the change? It's not what I imagined it would be
But I do see it. More understanding but less compassion.

[Lochie]

Yeah its unfair how Homo's are treated, I mean some people may look gay but hey, they could be rootin' your wife right now.

[Evil Gay]

QUOTE (just another thug @ Apr 20 2005, 02:04)

Well there are already people outhere spreading their views and ideals and educating others. Is society changed, no. So your plan hasn't worked yet.

You know, the world didnt start in 1980. If you want to change society in a couple of years then your right. We wont be going nowhere. But think back 70 or 60 years, or even 50. Black people were discriminated beyond belief. Seperate toilets, not being allowed to go to school. Go further back, and you will end up with slave labouring. These days homosexual weddings are allowed in some countries, and more are following. Society IS changing. It might not be fast, but it is.

[Luke]

The amount of racism and sexism has and is going down slowly, though when it comes to homophobia, I agree entirely, that it's not going down at a rate fast enough. Homophobic insults are commonly used with little notice taken as to the ignorance of those who say it, it slips too often.

just another thug: Society has changed, and is changing, it changes all the time. In some respects it changes for the better. There are still nazis, homophobes, racists, sexists out there, but their numbers are decreasing slowly.

[Dublo 7]

Homophobia is not going to go away. Hell look, the new pope that has been elected is a blatant homophobic. Its quite sad actually.

This post has been edited by dublo_7 on Thursday, Apr 21 2005, 00:15

[Taxman]

QUOTE (dublo_7 @ Apr 20 2005, 19:12)

Homophobia is not going to go away. Hell look, the new pope that has been elected is a blatant homophobic. Its quite sad actually.

Ah.....proof of homophobia?

But, yeah, where I live, tend to use fag/gay/homo as an insult more then anything else (well, except jew, but that's my neighbor). People are much to thickheaded...and they take small things that may be slightly homosexual too much. Like one guy I know, wore eyeliner to school one day, and he's been branded gay, and gets a hard time out of it.

[Dublo 7]

QUOTE (Taxman @ Apr 21 2005, 14:07)

QUOTE (dublo_7 @ Apr 20 2005, 19:12) Homophobia is not going to go away. Hell look, the new pope that has been elected is a blatant homophobic. Its quite sad actually. Ah.....proof of homophobia? But, yeah, where I live, tend to use fag/gay/homo as an insult more then anything else (well, except jew, but that's my neighbor). People are much to thickheaded...and they take small things that may be slightly homosexual too much. Like one guy I know, wore eyeliner to school one day, and he's been branded gay, and gets a hard time out of it.

You havent heard?
There is heaps of disagreements about this new pope. He said himself that Gays were sent from hell.

[Tom Toole]

Homosexuals? "some people think" they are disgusting. "some people believe" our society is not accepting of them. "some people think" they are neither natural nor responsible nor part of the humanity that god made in his image...

[ADJ]

What? That's ridiculous! The pope can't talk like that - he'll start a riot

This post has been edited by ADJ on Thursday, Apr 21 2005, 20:21

[Cerbera]

QUOTE (ADJ @ Apr 21 2005, 21:19)

What? That's ridiculous! The pope can't talk like that - he'll start a riot

Ever heard of the Crusades?

I'm glad to see the issue of homophobia has now been raised in the context of religion, since they have the most homophobic, prejudiced, bigoted values of all lifestyles. Not to say all theists are hate-filled Nazis since there are plenty of homosexual followers of religion but the authorities who maintain these institutions are always very "orthodox" and conservative. As demonstrated in the Should Danish Lesbians have Children? thread, homosexuality is of no detriment to society and is actually a sympton of a society which is flourishing culturally, scientifically and economically.

However, all major religions are still stuck in the Middle Ages (or even the Dark Ages when the Catholic church banned all free thought for centuries and reversed all progress in European civilisation) at their topmost level. Changing to accept the facts is not in their nature (see also: solar system, evolution, women).

Homophobia in the modern world comes mainly from religions but they are not the only entities ignorant enough to still encourage it. It is slowly being eroded but with tabloid newspapers and glossy magazines treating every instance of homosexuality amongst public figures as being sensationally depraved, our national culture and intellect cannot progress beyond it.

QUOTE (Wikipedia)

In 1966, he took a chair in dogmatic theology at the University of Tübingen, where he was a colleague of Hans Küng but was confirmed in his orthodox views by the liberal atmosphere of Tübingen and the Marxist leanings of the student movement of the 1960s. This was radicalised in Germany in 1967 and 1968 following the shooting of student Benno Ohnesorg at a demonstration (in June 1967) and an assassination attempt on student leader Rudi Dutschke (April 1968), culminating in a series of disturbances in April and May 1968 in which two journalists died in Munich in unexplained circumstances, and 400 people were injured. Ratzinger came increasingly to see these and associated developments (decreasing respect for authority among his students, the rise of the German gay rights movement) as related to a departure from traditional Catholic teachings. Increasingly, his views, despite his reformist bent, contrasted with those liberal ideas gaining currency in the theological academy. In 1969 he returned to Bavaria, to the University of Regensburg. (source)

There are some interesting notes at the bottom of that article which give you a better insight into the new Pope. Benedict XVI: Ratzinger's positions on issues facing the Catholic Church from the New York Times gives short quotes of what his views on such things are. Specifically regarding homosexuality, a News report talks about Ratzinger's views:

QUOTE (News report)

Ratzinger said the church clearly teaches "the intrinsic evil of homosexual activity," and that the archbishop was "ambiguous on this delicate, but important issue. A compassionate ministry to homosexual persons must be developed that has as its clear goal the promotion of a chaste lifestyle."

Since the Pope is actually the head of the Universal Church (which includes all Christians) we can look forward to a good few years of religiously-certified homophobia around the world. I just hope that the people being preached to are too intelligent to fall for it. That might well be an unrealistic prediction.

This post has been edited by Cerbera on Tuesday, Apr 26 2005, 17:16

[ADJ]

Well said, Cerbera. I agree entirely.